Question about Samson Technology Zoom R16 Multitrack Workstation

3 Answers

Problem with ZOOM R-16: I have a delay near 0,06 seconds between click and audiofile after 10 minutes of playback (near 0,01%) Thank you!

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  • Victor Shevtsov May 25, 2011

    Hello fredy2

    it's a good advise but not for me.
    You see, we must to have a prevously recorded in computer audio with click only in a phones
    output (for our drummer) and the audio without click in main output (for other musicians).
    Now I solve the problem by previous time squeezing of the audio
    for 0,0075% slow.
    Can I compensate the drift in my R16?

    Thank you

  • Victor Shevtsov May 25, 2011

    Hello fredy2

    it's a good advise but not for me.
    You see, we must to have a prevously recorded in computer audio with click only in a phones
    output (for our drummer) and the audio without click in main output (for other musicians).
    Now I solve the problem by previous time squeezing of the audio
    for 0,0075% slow.
    Can I compensate the drift in my R16?

    Thank you

  • Victor Shevtsov May 27, 2011

    Hello fredy2,

    thank you for detailed answer, but
    let me describe my situation more exactly.

    I make some audio in Cubase in tempo 100bpm, for example.
    Then I import it as a .wav file to R16. Previously I checked, that
    a click of R16 corresponds my Cubase arrangement with precision
    within 5 ms on 10 minutes of playing (I record a click at 100 bpm and import it to
    Cubase track). This precision is acceptable for me - it's better than
    0.001%.

    Then I play the audio in R16 and found a delay about 60 ms between
    audio and a click in 10 minutes of playback
    - it's 10 times worse (0,01%) and, of course, fully unacceptable.
    So, I think, it's not a problem about tweeking two different digital sources.
    Simply my R16 always plays audio approximately for a 0,001% faster then click and
    it's, as I think, an internal problem of R16.

    As I said, I solved the problem by previous time stretching of importing to R16
    audio from 100 bpm to 100,0075 bpm - and in this case I have the delay not more than 5 ms.
    But this solution, as you can see, rather inconvenient.

    How do you think, is it possible to correct audio playback of R16 for a 0,0075%
    and remain click at the same tempo?

    Thank you again!

  • Victor Shevtsov May 28, 2011

    Thank you again,

    but, as I said, for my present task accuracy within 0.001% is acceptable.

    As I know from my experience, accuracy, for example, while opening of an arrangement
    made at another computer (and/or with another program sequencer) is more better than 0.001%, so I can assume that precision of computer system is not the main problem - the problem is that R16 always plays audio approximately for a 0,01% faster then click.
    It's 10 times worse that I need.

    Can you help me with the problem of R16 specifically?

  • Victor Shevtsov Jun 02, 2011

    Hello,
    I have the problem with ZOOM R-16:

    I make some audio in Cubase in tempo 100bpm, for example.
    Then I import it as a .wav file to R16. Previously I checked, that
    a click of R16 corresponds my Cubase arrangement with precision
    within 5 ms on 10 minutes of playing (I record a click at 100 bpm and import it to
    Cubase track). This precision is acceptable for me - it's better than
    0.001%.

    Then I play the audio in R16 and found a delay about 60 ms between
    audio and a click in 10 minutes of playback
    - it's 10 times worse (0,01%) and, of course, fully unacceptable.
    So my R16 always plays audio approximately for a 0,01% faster than click and
    it's, as I think, an internal problem of R16.

    Can you help me with the problem?
    Thank you!

  • Victor Shevtsov Jun 04, 2011

    No, the delay don't happens every 10 minutes, it's a permanent drift and there is no any overheating of the device. And I always use the same audio format at Cubase and Zoom R16 - 44.1khz/ 24 bit (or rarely 16 bit) and always have the same result.
    Can you help me with fine tuning of R16, if it's possible?

  • Victor Shevtsov Jun 07, 2011

    No, the delay don't happens every 10 minutes, it's a permanent drift and
    there is no any overheating of the device. And I always use the same
    audio format at Cubase and Zoom R16 - 44.1khz/ 24 bit (or rarely 16 bit)
    and always have the same result.
    Can you help me with fine tuning of R16, if it's possible?

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Hi, it depends on the software you are using and the parameter that you set the delay..You will need to check on that.

Also depends if your using the consoles effects or the software effect that might be affect the payback songs you play..

When you finish checking the level at which you set the delay on the particular track your recording,Get back to me..Ok.


Take care.

Posted on Jun 05, 2011

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Usually when there are delays in playback mostimes it is as a result. Of the rendering speed which the unit uses in decoding the song. But if your delay happens every 10mins as you said the problem could be from ? specific batch of songs or as a result of a unit problem maybe from overheating but usually when the problem is overheating it keeps on delaying but the delay could also be a warning of impending cooling failure. Also the control unit could be suffering from similar system failure hence the breaks and delays. But mostly if the audiofiles are the same format try ? different set of formats and check if the problem persists. Hope this solution has been helpful?

Posted on Jun 04, 2011

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  • Samson Techn... Master
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Make sure you RECORD the original click with the music. The click generated afterwards may not track the playback.

Posted on May 24, 2011

  • Fred Yearian May 25, 2011

    Apparently your timing is coming from two sources. Been there done that... Unfortunately the ear is sensitive to 1 ms I found by testing. Since the timing is drifting, there is no way to tweek two separate sources that are on different precision internal timers... The problem is that any tweeking you are trying is done by digital timers and they count-down circuitry is in discrete steps and as a result you can't find a perfect tweek... It will either be fast or slow. A ten minute time is hard to get to stay within 1 ms. I know, as I have tried to match tempo in an organ MIDI convertor using a scope and tweeking numbers with 1 part in 65000 and barely can have fine enough resolution with that to hold for ten minutes. So I would GIVE UP trying to tweek... and let's explore other possibile methods. Could you record a MIDI timing and then on playback send it to a drum machine to generate the beat for the drummer? We need to record something that is time synced to the rest of the recording. The other possibility is to record a SEPARATE "click track" and use a mixer to send to drum monitor but not to the others.

  • Fred Yearian May 28, 2011

    Anything that uses a PC as part of a timing device is not practical for what you want. The internal timebase in the PC will have the LATENCY of the interrupt system and that MAY depend on background programs which you have little control over. The real time clock within the PC has the latency time of the service routines. Tweeking this time will be very frustrating and when you think you might have it close, a small change in the program may send it totally out of acceptability. With what you are trying to do, I would recommend looking into professional grade recording devices that offer time code syncronization. At this point, Cubase which I assume you are using in the computer is likely to be the device/system that is contributing the error, since it has the inaccuracies inherent in a PC in regards to real time timing. The errors due to system latency variations ultimately will be outside of your acceptable accuracy. You might want to set up a precision timer, say a counter with timebase accuarte out to 7 or eight digits to analyze the accuracy of the Cubase recording.

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