Question about HP (253232-001) (253232001) Power Supply

3 Answers

Hi, About HP power supply part number: 226519-001. It als has spare part # 253232-001. I need the diagram of its DC connector. Do you know who is the orginal power supply manufacturer? Kind regards, Valery Bliss

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  • 2 more comments 
  • Valery Bliss
    Valery Bliss Mar 18, 2011

    Hi,
    Thank you very much. Yes, 226519-001 is exactly the same as ASTEC HPS3KW.
    The output voltage of my 226519-001 is 51.35V. The voltage is absolutely constant even at max current 57A. I need to reduce it to 48V or lower. I opened the power supply and located a potentiometer. I was able to reduce the voltage to 50.45V. The potentiometer (about 5mm square) is in very tight place and I cannot explore it further.
    I thought the power supply with have V sense signal and I would be able to use it to adjust the output to 48V. However reading HPS3KW document there is no such sensing signal. Indeed there is signal called 48LS, but do not know what it does. There is no example of its use.
    Do you have any idea how to reduce the voltage?
    Ideally I would like to convert the power supply to constant current.

    Thanks and regards,
    Valery

  • Valery Bliss
    Valery Bliss Mar 20, 2011

    Yes, I will try to source another power supply that has at least VS and VS-. e.g. Cisco WS-CAC-4000W or Cisco WS-CAC-6000W. The best is to get a EMI/EMS/Lambda/XFR power supply 60-40 and use it.
    Also now I know that reducding the voltage down is very difficult and will desing the cell pack with spares, so that I can remove plates and get to voltage that works best with a particular PSU.

  • Valery Bliss
    Valery Bliss Nov 27, 2011

    Hi Errico,
    Great work! Thank you.I will test it.
    Is there a way to make out of this power supply Constant Current, say 55A?For example when there is no load the Voltage to rise to 51V.When I start drawing current and the current reaches 55A then the voltage to start dropping and keep the current 55A. So the the actual voltage to go 45V then 40V, and lower if necessary.The quality of rectification is not important. Even ripples of 0.5V are OK for my application.
    If for this power supply is difficult to achieve because of its complexity, can it be done for 12V computer ATX power supply.Kind regards,Valery

  • Valery Bliss
    Valery Bliss Nov 27, 2011

    Hi Errico, I have just tested it. Perfection! I removed the old pot quite easily. I just pushed it and it dropped. The I soldered 8.2Kom pot. I was able to reduce the voltage to 44.78V.

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Posted on Mar 18, 2011

Testimonial: "Great feedback. I was looking for this information for months. I contacted HP many times, but received nothing. Great!"

  • 15 more comments 
  • Bud Martin
    Bud Martin Mar 18, 2011

    More info for you, it is made by ASTEC SEMICONDUCTOR, MODEL HPS3KW.

    Here is the spec sheet: http://www.datasheetarchive.com/HPS3KW-d... with pin out.

  • Valery Bliss
    Valery Bliss Mar 18, 2011

    Hi,

    Thank you very much for the information. Indeed 253232-001 is exactly the same as ASTEC HPS3KW. I have it working stand alone and it produces 51.35V. It maintains same voltage even at max current 57A. This is too high voltage for me. I need 48V or bellow. I opened it and found a potentiometer (about 5mm square) and using it I was able to reduce the voltage to 50.55V. It is still high for me. I thought the power supply will have V sense, so that I can trick it, however when reading the specification I can not find such signal. Indeed there is a 48LS signal, but I do not know what it does.
    Do you have any idea how to reduce the voltage?

    How the power supply can be converted to Constant Current?

    Kind regards,
    Valery

  • Bud Martin
    Bud Martin Mar 19, 2011

    You can build constant current source which fed by the regulated power supply, in this case, the HPS3KW. Just Google 'Constant current source circuits' design'. How much current are you looking for?
    You can build simple one using regulator IC. http://www.discovercircuits.com/C/consta...

  • Valery Bliss
    Valery Bliss Mar 19, 2011

    Hi,

    Thank you for the information.
    I need DC constant current power supply for about 60A . Nominal voltage 42-50V. The quality of the stabilization is not important. I use it for HHO/Brown Gas. Total power of the power supply 3-4KW. I bought 253232-001 new from e-bay in Australia just for $46.
    There is a better power supplier from Cisco WS-CAC-6000W. I have the pin out from EMERSON. These power supplies are great however at lot higher price. It is available only form US are higher transport cost.
    There is a 3KW power supply HCP3000PS48 that allow constant voltage or current configuration. I can not find this power supply for sale. I have its specification and pin out.

    Any ideas?

    Kind regards,

  • Valery Bliss
    Valery Bliss Mar 19, 2011

    Hi,

    Even Cisco WS-CAC-4000W has good current, but do not know if I can adjust it.

    Regards,
    Valery

  • Bud Martin
    Bud Martin Mar 19, 2011

    I look up the HCP3000PS48, the programmed current out is for maximum it will allow to put out, it is regulated output voltage power supply for up to current limit setting.
    What is the HHO/Brown Gas and why does it need constant current feeding it, constant current power supply will vary it output voltage to get the desired regulated current to flow through the load. Is this load variabled?

  • Bud Martin
    Bud Martin Mar 19, 2011

    OK, I look up the HHO/Brown gas, you are trying to Oxyhydrogen - Fuel from Water? http://brownsgas.com/
    The 60A current needed at 48vdc or so means that the load is about 0.8 Ohm. So if the maximum output voltage from constant power supply source is 48vdc, it means that it will not be able to maintain 60A through the load if the load resistance goes higher than 0.8 Ohm.
    May be you can explain the setup of this HHO/BROWN GAS functions so I will understand the requirement of the power supply and what type it has to be.
    The regulated power supply can supply contant voltage of 48v to the load with maximum current of 50 (60)A.

  • Valery Bliss
    Valery Bliss Mar 19, 2011

    Hi,
    HHO is produced with electrolytic cell with high concentration of Sodium Hydroxide NaOH. Usually 25%wt. When is cool the resistance is low and the current is low. Therefore HHO gas production is low. At this time in order to maintain constant gas production we have to increase the current, so the voltage is to increase. When the cell is hot - about 70-80degrees C, the cell resistance is low therefore start to consume too much current, therefore we need to reduce the voltage on the cell.
    For example see this:http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/HHO-2-4-L...

    My generator is rather large compared to those on e-bay. I have sized it for 48V, but unfortunately the 48V power supply 253232-001 give me 51.35V which is a lot more than what I require. It appears that my HHO generator at 80 degrees would use about 4KW. I did not expect to go to that high temperature, but at this temperature the best gas is coming.

    Kind regards,
    Valery

  • Valery Bliss
    Valery Bliss Mar 19, 2011

    HHO generator is very sensitive to voltage above 2V per cell. The function is exponential.

  • Valery Bliss
    Valery Bliss Mar 19, 2011

    The current rises very fast that is why constant current power supply would perform better.

  • Valery Bliss
    Valery Bliss Mar 19, 2011

    If there is a regulated power supply, constant current. I need the power supply to be adjusted to give 50A. To maintain this current the power supply voltage will range from 48V (when the cell is cold) to 42V when the cell is hot (80 degrees).

  • Bud Martin
    Bud Martin Mar 19, 2011

    Ok, thanks for the explanation, I will have to study up on it more, it sounds like some kind of fuel cells?
    So when it is cold the resistance is HIGH os less current will flow through the liquid, but to get constant gas out put, the voltage is increased which at the same time the cell will get hotter and its resistance goes down causes more current to flow if the voltage source is kept contant, so the the voltage has to go down. I see why you will need contant current feeding this thing, and worst case it can draw as much as 60A? But since the cell cannot be exposed to above 2v at the same time, this can be very complicate regulation of both voltage and current.
    How do other people do it? This is very interesting!

  • Valery Bliss
    Valery Bliss Mar 19, 2011

    People manufacture current controllers for HHO, however they are only for 12V.
    In addition they do not work correctly.
    The trick is that the efficiency of the cell (Liter of gas produced for Watt of energy) depends strongly on the applied voltage. When the voltage is high the cell produces too much heat and little good gas.
    Those off the shelf current controllers do not regulate the voltage on the cell to reduce the voltage, but they change the duty cycle of the full voltage pulses sent to the cell. This is no good. I already build several of those with a 800A Pulse MOS transistor. I do not use it now because it is not a good method to control the cell.
    The voltage must be reduced when the cell gets hot. You would be surprise how millivolts change in the power supply voltage changes the current in Amps.

  • Bud Martin
    Bud Martin Mar 19, 2011

    That is very sensitive, I wonder how they will make power supply with the output voltage and current you need with very low ripple voltage in millivolts range (<10 millivolts?) that will be small enough not to affect the cell, you will need power supply with KELVIN connection to really get good regulation since voltage drops on the power lead will be important also. I really do not have much suggestion at this point but please keep post on your result of the solution you may have found, thanks.

  • Valery Bliss
    Valery Bliss Mar 19, 2011

    Short ripples are not a problem. E.g 253232-001/HPS3KW is actually too good for the purpose from ripples point of view.

    HPS3KW has a 48LS signal on pin 1-A.
    I am wondering If I could use this signal to force the power supply to limit the current, in effect forcing it to reduce voltage.

    I can not find a reference how to control the signal on 48LS externally.
    I found this document, but can not figure it out.http://focus.ti.com/lit/ug/sluu166a/sluu...

  • Valery Bliss
    Valery Bliss Mar 20, 2011

    I used the 48LS pin. When I connect it to V the voltage increases to 52.45V.
    I also used a pot to adjust, but I was not able to reduce the voltage or simulate current sharing.

  • Bud Martin
    Bud Martin Mar 20, 2011

    I think if you can get a hold of the sch of the power supply then you may be able to modify it. So far I do not see any thing on this ASTEC power supply.

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Hello Valery, you found a solution to reduce the output voltage from HPS3KW?
The trimmer inside is very inaccessible and
I would not use the diodes do not dissipate power unnecessarily.
Thanks
Errico

Posted on Nov 06, 2011

Testimonial: "Hi Errico, I have just tested it. Perfection! I removed the old pot quite easily. I just pushed it and it dropped. The I soldered 8.2Kom pot. I was able to reduce the voltage to 44.78V."

  • Errico Prota Nov 23, 2011

    Finally I got the solution to reduce the voltage of HPS3KW supply by ASTEC/HP and so on. :)

    1) Desolder carefully small square SMD trimmer on the edge of vertical little PCB near supply's positive output (it's a 700 ohm trimmer). It's no easy accessible.
    This trimmer has a GND connection, when cursor is shorted to GND the output voltage is maximum (53V) . If you lift the line from GND with a resistor, the output does reduce to lower output voltage.
    With a multimeter I read abt 0.5 V on the original trimmer pins at 51 V output.

    2) Put a 3k3 trimmer and you can adjust low to 48 V or so. I put a fix 2k2 resistor and I got about 48 V output.

    You must use a small soldering tip when desoldering SMD device, please don't touch the cermet through hole trimmer on the bigger vertical board and don't run the supply without any resistor or trimmer fitted on the board.

    WARNING : High voltage inside ... also 50 V may be dangerous, please work carefully when supply is open, I decline all responsability for this mod.

    The supply works nice at 48V!
    Sorry for my english, I haven't pictures at moment.

    Errico

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  • 1,591 Answers

Ok, that's a 3000W supply (not your average PS 500W or less supply) so if you're thinking of adapting another supply...well, regular supplies aren't 48Volts output either, so....
I recommend getting a replacement. These can be had on Ebay for under $20 (not bad for a $250 supply) or from other retailers for about $25.
Probably a lot cheaper to replace than repair and rigging a PC power supply is just out of the question.

Posted on Mar 18, 2011

  • 1 more comment 
  • Norman Skinner
    Norman Skinner Mar 18, 2011

    Well, now that I know what you're trying to do...as far as I know, these power supplies are rated at 48V 5% meaning you can adjust up but not down.
    You need to drop a specific number of volts without getting fluctuations so I suggest simply tacking a few high wattage diodes to the output.
    For instance, if you wanted to drop ~ 2.4V - 2.8V, add 4 diodes rated at at least 48V 3000W. You will find diodes like this are usually classified as TV diodes or TVS.
    They're cheap, so give yourself some room and go a fair bit over voltage and over current if you can to avoid thermal breakdown.

  • Valery Bliss
    Valery Bliss Mar 19, 2011

    Hi,
    I currently use resistors to reduce the voltage. Regardless resitors or diods are use the current is great and the dissipated power is too great and causing problems. I need to reduce the voltage coming from the power supply. It supposed to be 48V, however by default it is 51.35V regardless of the current.

    Regards,
    Valery

  • Norman Skinner
    Norman Skinner Mar 19, 2011

    Resistors would drop a varying amount of voltage in proportion to the current being drawn...bad solution if you need a consistent voltage! Diodes will drop a specific voltage no matter the current being drawn - you just need to make sure you have large enough diodes to handle the current and voltage being used. If you tried using diodes to reduce the voltage I'm sure it'd work for you.
    You're going to need about 5 diodes in series to get the voltage you want, but I'd get a few more just in case you're a little off the mark initially or want to drop below 48V.

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