Question about Xantrex Technology Heart Freedom 20 12 Inverter

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My 2000 Fleetwood Discovery Motorhome has a Heart Freedom Combi Inverter/Charger 2000 watt. I have 120 volts going to the input but have 0 Volts on output #1 and #2 unless I go from Neutral (white) to ground or hot (black) to ground, in which case I have 120 Volts. Terry

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  • kenaicoach Aug 25, 2010

    With the inverter input connected and the load removed from the two outputs I have 120 VAC input (between the white and black leads). On both output #1 and output #2 I have 0 volts between the black and white leads but I do have 120 VAC between the white to ground and also 120 VAC between the black to ground. Yes the breakers are on, the fuses are good. Terry

  • kenaicoach Aug 25, 2010

    Ok I will try that. My meter is a Fluke 337 true RMS clamp meter. Thanks, Terry

  • kenaicoach Aug 26, 2010

    Thank you. I will do that. Terry

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Terry this unit has 2 AC outputs so the reading that you got is correct. I am trying to surmise the actual problem that you have. You may have lost a system ground in the mobile home which would give you power as you stated but no power to the mobile home as the system ground has been lost.

Dumb questions time.

1. Battery voltage above 10 Volts?
2. Have you checked the DC Fuse?
3. Have you reset the breaker on the control panel?

Last test.. is to disconnect all outputs and try a voltage test again. A system distribution short will cause the inverter to go into the self protect mode.

Kelly

Have you reset the breaker

Posted on Aug 25, 2010

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  • Kelly
    Kelly Aug 25, 2010

    Terry this is from Xantrex about their ground:



    Floating neutral

    The XPower inverters do not have their neutral bonded to ground. This is called a floating neutral which causes there to be any value of voltage between hot and ground and from neutral to ground.
    As long as the proper amount of voltage is present from hot to neutral measured with a true RMS voltmeter, the inverter is working correctly.
    The XPower is designed to have loads plugged directly into it so the fact that the neutral is not bonded to ground is not a safety concern.
    Never bond an Xpower's neutral to ground as this will damage the inverter and will not be covered under warranty.
    Never connect the AC output of an Xpower to an existing electrical system as the vast majority of residential electrical systems do have the neutral bonded to ground.



    I am going back to research Still tyring to assertain what your actual failure is. I am thinking you have no power output anywhere. Are there any LED's lit?



    Kelly

  • Kelly
    Kelly Aug 25, 2010

    Xantrex has really good techincal support you can contact them here.



    http://www.xantrex.com/support/case/tech...



    I have to apologize about not grasping the problem here. I am thinking that your doing the measurements without a true RMS meter and that your getting false readings.



    I hate to site a google search as a reference but these are examples of true RMS Meters:

    http://www.google.com/images?hl=en&s...



    Kelly

  • Kelly
    Kelly Aug 25, 2010

    Terry,

    I think you should perform this continuity test and the real problem may show up. Get a really long piece of wire and plug it into an outlet line (black) or neutral (white). Then disconnect your inveryter output. Use that long piece of wire as a long meter test lead and read continuity back to the disconnected inverter output. ONE of them will read continuity if the chassis wiring is good. ALSO read that same wire to chassis ground to make sure you do NOT have a distribution short. Switch the long lead to the opposite outlet terminal and perform the same checks. Continuity of the distribution wire and to the chassis ground.



    Kelly

  • Kelly
    Kelly Aug 26, 2010

    Hi again Terry. I may have sent you on a wild goose chase. I had to go back and read everything that was discussed for that keen sense of the obvious to hit me right between the eyes.



    Per Xanatrex: As long as the proper amount of voltage is present from hot to neutral measured with a true RMS voltmeter, the inverter is working correctly.



    You stated that you had 0 volts hot to neutral using your Fluke 337 Meter. (nice meter!) That is telling us the that inverter itself has a problem.



    ^--That can be from low battery voltage of less than 13.3 volts.



    Are you seeing any fault LED's illuminated on the control panel?



    Last question this post.. and beacuse of the way the system is set up I can NOT see all posts when replying. You may have alread answered this question.



    The question is: With the load / distribution leads disconnected do you have good output voltage on the output terminals using your Fluke 337?



    Kelly

  • Kelly
    Kelly Aug 26, 2010

    Another thought I have is from what I have read so far this inverter has 2 AC outputs. I am assuming you have checked both outputs.



    Kelly

  • kenaicoach Aug 26, 2010

    I have found the problem. It is a stuck relay on a circuit board. I need to know who I can order the circuit board from as the repair center here will not sell it without doing the installation. Terry

  • Kelly
    Kelly Aug 26, 2010

    Good job on the relay find.



    I came to the conclusion yesterday that it was in internal relay on the board when that keen sense of the obvous hit me and was going to ask that you check power on the board next at the relay.



    There are several sources for relays. Do you have any numbers printed on the relay on the board. I am not kidding just google search the number and you will find sources. Search parameters any search engine: relay "numberhere" in quotes. If it is realy bad as in a zillion results try doing an image search same parameters



    However there are a bunch of distributors / exporters that will come up in the process. You have to weed thru them to find a source. If you can not locate a source pass the numbers off the relay and I am pretty sure I can find you a source in the next 24 hours.



    Kelly

  • Kelly
    Kelly Aug 27, 2010

    Terry a few last comments here. Have you checked the relay coil power? The PCB transformers are notorious for loosing 1 leg of power and you end up changing a relay only to find out the PCB transformer is bad. (Been there done that!) Now I always check the PCB transformer outputs and relay coil power inputs before changing relays. Most PCB transformers have the output voltages on them just above the terminals. Sometimes you have to use a magnifying glass just to see the terminal labels. The usually are in pairs as in pins 1 and 2 = input power 120VAC, 3 - 4, 5 - 6, 7 - 8 all are output AC low voltage power out with the output power being converted to DC via diodes on the main board.



    There will always be that question in the back of your mind.... "What caused the relay or the PCB transformer to fail? My experience is... either water intrusion on to the board or corrosion on the main board. 90 percent of them can be cleaned with isoprophyl alcohol and Q-tips then returned to service after parts replacement.



    It was nice working with you on this one. I respect a person that can use a bit of know how and personal skills how to resolve a tough issue.



    I was serious about helping you find a relay if you need help. I just need the number off of your relay.



    Kelly

  • Kelly
    Kelly Aug 27, 2010

    I know this web page is in the UK. Use the page for looking at your relay needs. I think your going to need either the WJ111 or the WJ114 That is a good part number... but not sure of your main board configuration as far as useabilty. Pretty comon relays though.



    http://www.relays-r-us.co.uk/webpages/pr...



    After you find which one you need.. then again the web searc by part number.





    Kelly

  • kenaicoach Aug 27, 2010

    Kelly, I ordered a new board (part #70013103) to be shipped out tomorrow and should have by Monday. Will let you know if that resolved the problem. Thanks again for your help. Terry

  • Kelly
    Kelly Aug 27, 2010

    I actually did do some more relay research and came up with 2 possible relays... (too late now)



    Both are NEC relays.



    R45−5D20−12 20 amp 5 pin



    and



    R25-5D16-12 16 amp 5 pin



    I don't think either one of them is more than $5.00



    Still got that hmm why did the original one fail hence my recomendation to check the output wires for chassis shorts when the inverter was disconnected. A stuck relay is usually due to a hot contact from a short or.. just an over time heat build up failure. Could just be one of them the inverter relay actually failed things or something else.



    Best of luck with the new 70013103 board. (Let me guess the only source is Xanatrex?) I am pretty sure you have tamed the beast and will be back to normal sometime early next week.



    Again it was a pleasure. This site never has been about the money for me.



    Kelly

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