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Cool air isn't generated by household AC. Groaning sound comes from the AC system packaged with the condenser coils outside (the heat pump ?) and the large fan in this unit doesn't turn on. Trane model TTR060C200A2

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  • jshook0927 Oct 06, 2009

    I removed the screws and propt open the top of the condenser to access the fan, it turns freely. Switched on the thermostat while top was propt open and the groaning appeated to come from down deep in the condenser housing. In the bottom of the condenser unit is a cylindrical unit that looks to pump freon thru the system (the compressor ?).



    Note, the night before last we switched on the AC before going to bed. It seemed to be taking a while to cool down, but I fell asleep anyway. Can't hear the condenser from the bedroom, worse case the system was run in this broken fashion overnight. Shouldn't there be a thermal cutoff on the complressor.



    Gettng back to the fan if we go this route. Should I buy the capacitor along with the motor. Just a thought, should I buy the capacitor wired into the compressor.

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  • Master
  • 909 Answers

By the description,of the problem, it sounds very much like your condensing fan motor has malfunctioned. Suggest you switch air conditioner off and open the top of the unit to gain access to the fan. Rotate by hand and observe if fan is stuck or obstructed. That is the only component in the condenser that will "groan". Very importantly, if the fan does not run, there will be no cooling. Another thing to note, do not run compressor for long periods without the fan running as the compressor will eventually burn out. Once you have proved the fan is not turning freely once you retry running the air conditioner, phone the trane suppliers and order the fan by quoting the above mentioned model number.Undo the appropriate screws and remove old fan, then replace with new.Connect wires exactly as you removed them.(normally 3).

Posted on Oct 06, 2009

  • Terence Fourie
    Terence Fourie Oct 06, 2009

    I think the best way to approach the problem is firstly to check if you have voltage on the terminals of the fan when you switch the compressor on. The squealing sound on the compressor could mean the compressor is faulty(possibly because the fan did not function), or because the voltage on the compressor is not correct.My bet is the compressor is faulty as well as the fan. In a case like that, it would be better to simply replace the condensing unit complete. Basically, 2 nuts are opened and the 4or 5 wires disconnected. No gas is required as the condensing unit comes pre charged.Sorry, but this time i suggest a refrigeration technician do the work as specific tools are needed.

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To continue from my last Question, to do with HVAC Evaporator/Condenser Cycles, how often should the System go into Heat Standby, Heat Defrost, and Heat Modes? What are Heat Standby and Heat Defrost?


In this type of system (heat pump), the evap and condenser swap functions by means of a reversing valve, according to the mode selected. Evaps throw off cool air, condensers, warm air. In heat mode, the condenser is the indoor coil and it throws off heat from the outside air. Vice versa for the cooling mode. Heat Standby would be whenever the temperature thermistor has reached set point by the user and shuts down the system. Heat defrost is the cycle that reverses refrigerant flow and defrosts the outdoor coil by sending warm refrigerant liquid to that coil. In heat mode, the outdoor coil builds frost and ice on its surface.

Feb 05, 2015 | Refrigerators

Tip

How Heat Pumps Work


How on earth can you get hot air or hot water from very cold outside air? How does a heat pump make this heat out of cold air?
When certain gases change their state from a liquid to a gas or from a gas to a liquid the magic happens.

A heat pump can do some pretty amazing things, when it comes to making heat. To understand the way they work, you must first understand what happens when certain gases change from a liquid state to a gas and back to a liquid again. To simplify it a bit we need to look at a basic air conditioning system. The refrigerant in an air conditioning system is changing to a liquid in the outdoor condenser. The compressor compresses the gas forming a hot gas. As this gas cools under high pressure it changes into a liquid form.

Inside the indoor coil the liquid is pushed through a small hole or orifice. When it comes out the other side it rapidly changes it’s state to a gas as the pressure suddenly drops. The rapid pressure drop changes the refrigerant to a very cold gas. Air flowing over the cold gas inside the pipes makes the air cool and provides air conditioning.


Now for a heat pump the process is much the same, only coils are just switched by used a reversing valve in the outdoor condenser unit. Instead of the heat being purged to the outside from the condenser unit, the indoor unit then becomes the condenser coil. The outdoor coil becomes the cold coil and cools the outside. This is why if it is very cold outside the unit will have to run in air conditioning mode for a short time to defrost the outside cold coil. When this happens the system will usually have electric heat inside to run and keep the indoor air warm.

The reality is that a heat pump is really no more than an air conditioner running in reverse. Through the magic of using refrigerants, a heat pump can then run many times more efficiently than straight electric heat. A careful heat loss/gain should always be performed by a qualified service person before any sizing of a unit. Too large or too small of a heat pump system can make it inefficient and possibly cause it to be very uncomfortable. The longevity of the unit can also be affected by sizing and installation. Be patient and look carefully for the best contractor to install your system.

A properly designed and installed heat pump system can give you many years of comfort and efficiency. If you look for and find the contractor that can do the job right you will get many trouble free comfortable years from your heat pump unit.

on Dec 29, 2009 | Heating & Cooling

Tip

Why your unit is freezing up.


To understand why your AC or heat pump is freezing up, it helps to know how your system works.

There are 7 major parts to an AC system, 9 with a heat pump.

1 - Condenser/heat pump (The outdoor unit)
2 - Air Handler (the indoor unit unless the system is a package unit, then all is outside in one system. The air handler is usually found under the home, in an attic, or in a closet.)

In the condenser are the following major parts.

3 - Compressor
4 - Condenser coil
5 - Condenser fan
6 - (HPs only) reversing valve

In the air handler are the following major parts.

7 - Blower motor
8 - Evaporator coil
9 - (HPs only) electric heat strips

Some systems known as "dual fuel systems" use another heat source in place of the heat strips, usually a gas furnace. I will address gas furnaces in another post.

When an air conditioner is operating properly several things are taking place.

1 - The compressor is compressing or "pumping" refrigerant through the system.

2 - through changes in pressure, the refrigerant makes the evaporator coil get very cold, and the condenser coil gets very hot.

3 - The blower motor/fan circulates air across the evaporator coils, as the room temperature air (Also known as "indoor ambient") goes through the cold coil, it exits, cooled approximately 15 to 20 degrees cooler than when it entered. (In a ducted system, the blower is also the fan that circulates the air throughout the home.)

4 - The condenser fan circulates air across the condenser coils. As the outdoor air goes through the condenser coil, it removes heat from the coils that are very hot. This in turn removes heat from the refrigerant so it can run its cycle again, and through pressure changes, cool the evap coil.

5 - With a heat pump, the reversing valve reverses the flow of refrigerant in the condenser and evaporator coils.
In AC mode, the evaporator coils get cold, and the condenser coils get hot. But in heat mode, the evaporator gets very hot, and the condenser very cold.

Now, whichever coil is getting cold will freeze up if there is inadequate air flow across the coil, as the refrigerant in it is far below freezing, and there is not enough airflow to keep the humidity in the air from freezing on the coil.

Things that can cause poor airflow are,

1 - Dirty/clogged coils
2 - dirty/clogged filter (will only effect evaporator coil)
3 - Closed/blocked vents (will only effect evaporator coil)
4 - Malfunctioning or dirty fan

Low refrigerant will also cause a coil to freeze up, reduce efficiency and cause the system to run for long periods of time. Not to mention, shortening the life of the unit.

With a heat pump, in heat mode only, the condenser (outdoor) coil will routinely begin to freeze up in cold temperatures. This is due to the fact that the refrigerant is below freezing, and the cold outdoor ambient temp is not warm enough to keep the condensation in the air from freezing on the coil.

Note, a properly working AC should never freeze up.

A heat pump is equipped with defrost controls to prevent ice buildup.
Some are controlled by timers, some by temp.

When a HP is going into defrost mode, the condenser fan shuts down, the reversing valve reverses the flow of refrigerant and the once cold condenser coil now gets very hot, defrosting the coil. (Many people have said this process sounds like the unit is coming apart, or about to explode and are frightened by the "smoke" which is really just steam from melting ice that comes off the unit.)

During defrost mode, the secondary or "auxiliary" heat comes on to ensure that you are still getting warm air from the vents. (Again, this can be electric heat strips or a dual fuel system)

If you are experiencing cold air from the vents during defrost, that means your auxiliary heat is malfunctioning.

The auxiliary heat is used for three purposes.

1 - during defrost mode to maintain warm airflow (automatic)
2 - when the HP cannot maintain the set temp due to extreme outdoor temps. It comes on when the indoor temp drops several degrees below the set temp on the thermostat (automatic)
3 - For emergency heat source when the HP is not working. (Manual)

To recap....

Iced up coils?

Poor airflow
low refrigerant
Malfunctioning fan
failing defrost system


There are two things that can be done in a pinch to help de-ice frozen coils. This may get you by until the repairman can get there, or you can fix the system if you are a do-it-yourselfer.

HPs frozen outdoor coil in heat mode, not going into defrost?

Cover most of the vents, and turn the system onto cooling mode until the outdoor coil is thawed. then uncover vents and return to heat, or emergency heat. (this usually takes 15 min or less)

Frozen coils in AC mode with a heat pump?
Turn the system to heat with the thermostat on just high enough to get the system to come on. (again, usually takes 15 min or less to thaw.)

AC only, with frozen evap coils? (this can sometimes be seen frozen all the way outside to the compressor on the copper lines.)

Turn the system off, and the fan switch from "auto" to on".
This will usually defrost the coils within 1 to 2 hours.
(If your system has the furnace in line before the evap coil, turn the system to heat, and the furnace will defrost the coil within minutes.)



on Dec 25, 2008 | Carrier XHB123D X/Y Series Heat/Cool Air...

1 Answer

Mr. Slim aint cool!


Unit short of refrigerant or outside condenser very dirty. Clean outside thoroughly and make sure there is plenty of warmth coming from it when working.

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1 Answer

Ac unit isn't blowing


It sounds like your freezing up at the coil, which in turn, blocks airflow across coil and only a small amount of air comes out of the vents. This also explains the cold air coming from fan on the outside unit, since the system cannot absorb the heat from the inside of the house through the coil. Your air outside is usually blowing out warm to hot air because thats the heat it rejects out of your system. I would turn the thermostat to "OFF" and turn just the fan setting to "ON" instead of Auto, this thaws the system out faster. Give it time to fully thaw, make sure filters are clean, and check airflow. If airflow is back to normal, your problem is more than likely the charge of refrigerant. If you have to call a technician out, make sure the unit is not frozen at all before they get there, they would not be able to do anything with the system froze. Hope this helps and good luck!

Jun 18, 2012 | Heating & Cooling

1 Answer

The air coming out isn't cool anymore and it keeps tripping the circuit breaker. The unit is 3 years old


Hello my name is Heath it will be my pleasure to assist you. The first thing to check is the filter in the furnace or air handler. Also check the inside coil to be sure its not frozen up. Does the air coming out feel cold? It sounds like the unit could be low on charge which means it has a leak and should be leak checked repaired and properly charged. You would need refrigeration gauges to put on the system in order to properly check the refrigerant charge in the system. One other thing could be a dirty condenser coil. Turn the power off to the unit and use a garden hose with a strong nozzle and spray water through the whole coil to try and blow any dirt or debris through the condenser coil in the outside unit.

Sep 03, 2011 | Royal Sovereign Heating & Cooling

1 Answer

Air conditioner isn't blowing cold! Fan works okay but air isn't cool. Can hear hissing sound that sounds like normal compressor function. Do I need a coolant recharge?


You will need the condenser coils repaired before you can charge it. These come from the factory sealed and they should not ever need a charge unless you have a leak. The hissing sound is more likely air in the system being pumped by the comressor and it is coming out a hole in the coils.

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1 Answer

GSH13 Goodman heat pump split system is running a long time in cooling mode and will not cool below 74 degrees. A lot of condensation generated. The low side pressures 78 to 81 and high side pressures are...


Check sub cooling and super heat. the New ac units are very critical to charge. There is a charging chart on the inside of the cover to the unit outside. Check temp difference across coil. Should be 18 to 22 degress. If you have an ampmeter. Check the heat strips one 5 kw might be stuck.(sequencer). This would cause you not be able to pull down temp. Goodman unit are hard to charge to get the temp difference across coil. Feedback please

Jun 14, 2009 | Goodman CLQ36AR49 Air Conditioner

3 Answers

Compressor will not start.


Usually short cycling means that High side pressure is getting to high (due to not working condenser fan, or dirty condenser coil), or low side pressure is getting too low (might have low level of freon or restriction in sealed system). low side would drop dramatically if indoor blower is not running, so if air is not circulating thru evaporator coil, coil will freeze up and low side would be much lower then normal. Here is video how I found issue with package AC not coming on. Thermostat call for cool, but condenser would not come on, indoor blower runs ok.

Nov 02, 2008 | Ruud UAMB Air Conditioner

2 Answers

Hi- Can not tell if my unites are straight cool / heat or a heat pump.


if you look inside the condenser unit outside,see if you see the big reversing valve,if not it is a straight cool,heat, the heat strip ins in the air handler so you would have to take the side panel off and look for the heat stripe,my the way heat pumps also have a aux.heat stripe just in case it does not get cold enough outside,hope this helps you-mike

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