Question about Ingersoll Rand Electrical Supplies
I can heat fuel and turn key and the gen will start and then go dead I can crank again and it will go dead. I can have someone hold the fuel shut off up and it will stay running none of the system check lights come on when you push the button to check the system this is a g25000 kw diesel
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Posted on Jan 02, 2017
SOURCE: Gen. set won't auto start.
This sounds a little like a bad wiring problem between the transfer switch and the generator. But before I leap to any unfounded conclusions let's make sure I understand just which Guardian generator and transfer switch you have. The generator I think you have is an air conditioner sized box that has a 2 cyl air cooled Generac GT990 engine in it. The control panel has a 15 amp fuse, and maybe a 7 amp one, some LED indicators, a 3 position rocker switch (manual,off,auto), and a momentary set exercise switch. If you look inside your transfer switch there is the transfer mechanism, a single relay, either 2 or 4 fuses, and a terminal board where 4 small control wires connect to the generator. The control wires will be labeled N1, N2, 193, and 23.
If all of that is true then I'll also assume that the generator is blinking all of the LEDs and as soon as you put the rocker switch in the manual position the generator starts and the transfer switch moves to the "generator" position. It shouldn't do that, manual means switch the switch manually too. :-)
Let's take care of the exercise setting first. Switch the main output breaker of the generator to the "off" position, this prevents the transfer switch from activating even if the generator runs. Next put the generators rocker switch into the "Auto" position and wait at least 1 minute, if the generator starts we have to fix the wiring between the N1 and N2 terminals in the transfer switch and the matching terminals in the generator before we can proceede. If luck was with us and the generator is just blinking its LEDs at you, press and hold the set exercise switch for 30 seconds, you're reseting a "watchdog" type circut so it has to be for the whole 30 seconds. When you let go of the set exercise switch the LEDs should blink another 10 times or so, then the generator should start and run its exercise for 12 minutes more or less and then it'll shut down. At that time the only LED that should be lit is the green "system ready" one and it should be steadily lit. Remember to close the output breaker again.
Next let's address the transfer switch issue. If I've understood you correctly, the transfer switch moves anytime you turn the generator on. The only reason a regular old RTS type transfer switch could do this is that it's being commanded to transfer. It works like this, the 2 coils that move the transfer mechanism get powered by the source we're trying to switch to, once the switch gets into the position it's going a pair of limit switches disconnect it from the power supply so that the coil is only "live" during a transition. Spring loaded contacts hold the switch in either position once it's more than halfway towards either one. The relay inside the box is also in line with the limit switches so that if the relay is deenergised the switch will try to get to the utility position and stay there, it can't if there is no utility power to drive the transfer coil. On the other hand if the relay is energised, the switch will try to get to the generator position and stay there, if there is no power from the generator it can't because the generator is what drives that bottom transfer coil. So I think that for whatever reason the relay in your transfer switch is staying energized when we don't want it to be.
On the terminal board inside the transfer switch you should see terminals labeled 194 and 23, these are the power to the relay coil (194), and the ground to transfer signal (23). With the generator set to off, and a fairly quiet room, disconnect the wire from terminal 23, if you can hear the relay coil click on and off when you touch the wire to terminal 23 there is something wrong with the wiring at the generator end of things. You should also see 12 volts DC between terminal 194 and ground, this comes from the generator too.
If the relay didn't click back and forth above check it by using a short piece of wire to connect terminal 23 to ground, if the relay isn't energised when terminal 23 is grounded and deenergized when terminal 23 is open you either have a bad relay or a problem in the grounding of your system. To get a bad relay fixed for free call up Guardian, register the generator (you'll need proof of purchase), and get them to tell you where your nearest warrenty service person is. If you tell him about this post he'll bring a relay with him when he comes to you.
If you're satisfied that the relay in the switch is working properly, we're on the trail of a wiring problem at the generator end of things. If the generator has just been installed you should carefully check that wire 23 hasn't been connected to terminal 0 at the generator terminal block. It's easy to get this connection wrong when doing th e install. The other thing that can go wrong is that the wire can get pinched inside the conduit and short to ground. To check this disconnect both ends of wire 23 and measure between either one and ground, you should get nearly infinite resistance.
If you've proved to yourself that all of the wiring is correct, and the generator is properly grounded, you probably have a broken control board in the generator. To get the control board replaced use the same procedure as the relay above.
If that doesn't get this resolved for you post a comment and we'll try a different approach.
Posted on Mar 06, 2009
Cleaning the brushes is used to address an AC output problem. If the generator would run for a few seconds after letting go of the button, then this might apply.
But, since yours is dying as soon as you let go of the button, that tells me that you are probably looking at a low oil condition, or a sensor / sending unit failure for oil level.
Without spec number, hard to remember if the sending unit is for low oil pressure, or low oil level. Either way, the ignition is being grounded. First, double check your oil level, make sure generator is reasonably level. If still not resolved, then locate the sending unit, and remove the wire that is on the end of it. There should be a connector either a few inches from the sending unit, or a few inches from the control board (coming from big white plug). Disconnect at either place. Try starting again. If it starts this time, double check oil levels. If those are fine, then sending unit has failed, or oil pump (if pressure unit) has failed. In either case, don't run for very long until sending unit is replaced, just in case.
Posted on Aug 25, 2009
Check for a low lube oil sensor problem first. Could be low oil pressure or a failed sensor. The sensor is timed and if pressure doesn't come up, then unit is shutdown.
Check fuel filter and also air leaks in the fuel supply lines.
Check if the fuel shutoff solenoid is responsible for the shutdown. If it closes just before the engine quits, then it is being commanded to shutdown, probably as a safety interlock.
Posted on Oct 11, 2009
Testimonial: "Very good info. I don't think I have a fuel shutoff seloniod unless it's internal to the injector pump."
This overflow can be caused by:
1. The float sticking
2. Gas inside of the float air chambers
3. The needle and seat have debris in them or a r damaged.
It is not a difficult fix but it does mandate removal of the carburetor float bowl.
You could probably do this yourself. It is much easier if you place the generator on a high work area so you can see the float and needle once you have the float bowl removed. Just make sure you do not drop the float assy so far that the needle comes out of the seat unless you have to remove the hinge pin SCREW for the float to clear the debris near the needles' pointed rubber head.
Thanks for using FixYa
Posted on Mar 22, 2010
It sounds like your unit may not be charging the battery properly.
Try charging the battery and see if it responds properly. If it does, then check the charging circuit. This OFTEN involves a rectifier module which is usually about 1 inch square with four leads. OFTEN there is a fuse, sometimes within the generator housing (stupid place) which protects the low voltage winding.
Here is a hint: Most of these engines have a compression release on the top that one can press then crank up to speed and release. This takes much less effort on the battery. Some have a panel held by bolts. I put hinges on mine for easy access.
REMEMBER the battery is being drained WHILE the unit is running to hold the fuel solenoid open... so if charging isn't working the battery will die.
Test: You should see about 13.75 to 14 volts across the battery when properly being charged while running.
Posted on Apr 06, 2010
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