Question about Maytag Neptune FAV6800AW Top Load Washer

1 Answer

Clutch bearing question - tub not spinning

Having similar problem as many with machine not spinning and stalling at the first spin cycle and never completing. I opened the lid during the cycle and see the tumplers will spin ok but the tub will not spin and cannot move in either direction by hand.

I did remove the clutch assembly. The sping mechanism looks good. I used WD-40 and some bearing lube on the needle bearings. But the bearings will only turn in one direction. Is that normal? Anyway, I reassembled (took a bit of work to get it completely seated) and tried but still having same issue.

As a note, the tub will turn freely by hand while the clutch is disengaged. As soon as it's seated, it's impossible to turn the tub by hand.

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  • jpdarrish Apr 21, 2009

    dh1200s,



    Thanks for the help and suggestions. Yes, I had the same issues before and after taking apart the clutch. I never get any error codes. The machine just continues in an endless loop if spins the tumblers for about 5-10 seconds, waiting for several minutes then doing it again. The wash basket never rotates.



    When the clutch is removed, the basket will turn by hand. In fact I had to have soemone slowly turn the basket until the clutch would fully seat all the way up to the 1/16-1/8" gap. Once seated, the basket will not turn in either direction. I can rotate the clutch pulley in both directions though which turns the tumblers only.



    Your pictures didn't show up in the post but mine does have the upper bearing assembly. I'm at work now, but when I get home I will try taking the clutch off and reinstalling just to be sure. And to make sure the basket isn't binding somewhere. Could it be the transmission? If it works mechanically, I'm thinking it might be the motor (or motor controller) not switching directions for spin properly?

  • jpdarrish Apr 22, 2009

    OK. Now I'm completey confused. I do have a series 10. What troubles me is the upper clutch bearing has two U-shaped protrusions on them that appear to fit up into two cavities on the underside of the outer basket housing. In fact, I can't seem to get the clutch assembly to have a small gap and/or keep from falling off unless I seat these two parts up. But if I do, then the basket is completely unable to move. Otherwise it spins freely in both directions. Am I missing something or is the part binding up somewhere else?

  • jpdarrish Apr 23, 2009

    With the help of dh1200s, I was able to identify the problem! I was assuming there was only one bearing in the assembly and that the shaft was pressed into the upper clutch part. As it turns out, the shaft was jammed up in my upper assembly (hiding the bearing inside) and keeping the wash tub from being able to spin.



    I pressed out the shaft from the bearing in the upper part. I tried using WD-40 and lube on this bearing as I did the lower but it looks to be beyond repair. I'll need to get a new clutch assembly (or at least a new upper part). Still much cheaper than a repair man would charge and I learned a lot about how the machine works. Thanks for the great help here.

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Hello jpdarrish,

“” Having similar problem as many with machine not spinning and stalling at the first spin cycle and never completing. I opened the lid during the cycle and see the tumplers will spin ok but the tub will not spin and cannot move in either direction by hand.”” Was this the original issue before you removed the clutch? Were you taking dc or UC errors to the display?

“”As a note, the tub will turn freely by hand while the clutch is disengaged. As soon as it's seated, it's impossible to turn the tub by hand.”” By disengaged do you mean that the clutch pulley was removed from the machine and the wash basket rotates CCW freely?

With the Clutch pulley installed properly the wash basket will only rotate CCW it will no rotate CW that is normal operation. You should beable to rotate the wash basket CCW with one finger and very little resistance with the clutch installed.

""I did remove the clutch assembly. The sping mechanism looks good. I used WD-40 and some bearing lube on the needle bearings. But the bearings will only turn in one direction. Is that normal? Anyway, I reassembled (took a bit of work to get it completely seated) and tried but still having same issue.""

Yes this a Drawn Cup Roller Clutch designed to rotate one way only clockwise for our FAV6800A/FAV9800A machines.
My description of how I believe the Roller clutch bearing engages the spinner shaft to spin the clutch basket.

This write up is my understanding of how this clutch system works in the FAV6800AW/FAV9800AW. I could be wrong and would invite any comments from the forum to help me better understand how the clutch works in wash and spin cycle;

The clutch in the FAV6800AW/FAV9800AW incorporates a Drawn Cup Roller clutch bearing. This roller clutch bearing will allow one-way rotation freely in clockwise rotation. The FAV6800AW/FAV9800AW washer uses a reversing motor which has power supplied by the motor controller. In wash cycle the motor controller powers the motor to produce clockwise rotation which turns the clutch pulley CW. The Roller Clutch Bearing spins freely in the CW direction so only the agitator shaft will rotate driving the transmission to rotate the tumblers. In spin cycle the motor controller powers the motor CCW. This rotates the clutch pulley CCW and the Roller Clutch Bearing locks up and drives the spinner shaft CCW. At the start of a spin cycle the tumblers will rotate ¼ to ½ turn of rotation and no more as the clutch spring is wound to tension. Once the spring is wound to tension the spinner shaft begins rotating the spinner plate which rotates the transmission and wash basket CCW. Because the transmission is spinning at the same rate as the wash basket the tumblers do not rotate. This will happen if the clutch spring is broken and in spin cycle the wash basket will spin very slowly with no clothes in the wash basket and the tumblers will rotate. You will need to replace the clutch.

Dose you clutch look like the one on the left or right? My is on the right and my machine is a series 16 1st digits of my s/n are 16.

Clutch bearing question - tub not spinning - 95e2d5e.jpg

cd804f6.jpg
If your Roller Clutch bearings rotate freely in CW direction and you installed the clutch pulley correctly you should beable to rotate the washbasket CCW with the lid open with one finger. If it dosent we have some binding issues with the clutch install. This is from a post of a forum member I helped. He has a good install fitment process. This is a challange but I can no do to it in less then 5 min. after a dozen or so clutch removal and installs of my machine.

""The Service manual download was very helpful because it has a few pictures to show the 1/16"-1/8" gap from the shaft to the clutch face. What this really is telling you is that "if" you get all the three parts (clutch plate- bearing sleeve and cream colored plastic piece with 2 raised projections) to the clutch assembly back in correctly, you will end up with the 1/16"-1/8" gap. I also did my repair by tilting the machine back and working on it in place. Test the fit of each of the 3 pieces seperately so you will have a better idea what you are trying to fit. The cream colored plastic piece with 2 raised projections "seats" into the bottom of the tub. The bearing also seats onto the shaft in the notches. The clutch simply fits on the square shaft. The trick is getting the 3 piece assembly on with every piece seated correctly. By no means impossible, but working in limited space it was the most difficult part to do. Something that I thought of (after the repair) was to actually cut out the sheet metal directly below the clutch. This would allow easy access for the reassembly.’”

Again I believe your original clutch uses the upper bearing piece, as pipespike states you have to get the fitment of the upper bearing assembly the bearing sleeve I call it the coupler and the clutch seated properly to get that 1/16"-1/8" gap shown in the Service manual page 47.

Try a reinstall of the clutch after reviewing the above comments. After the clutch reinstall first try to rotate the wash basket CCW with one finger it should offer very little resistance and not rotate in a CW direction.

Post back for any additional help. Rich

Posted on Apr 20, 2009

  • 4 more comments 
  • dh1200s
    dh1200s Apr 21, 2009

    If the clutch is properly seated you should beable to rotate the wash basket CCW by hand. The question is what is causing the binding? Can you loosen the 3/8" clutch pulley bolt a a turn or two to see if that will allow you to rotate the wash basket by hand with I hope slight resistance. I can turn the wash basket in my FAV6800AWW with my pinky finger. We need to ID what is causing the resistance to the CCW spin rotation of the washer by hand before we even power up the machine. I'm stuck at work for another hour. When I get home I will give this some more concentrated thought. Good Luck Rich

  • dh1200s
    dh1200s Apr 22, 2009

    Hello jpdarrish,

    Sorry for the pics that did not post, my bad. My series 16 FAV6800AWW doesn’t use the upper Clutch roller bearing as your series 10 does.

    Pic on left I believe is what you have, pic on right is mine. Still sounds like a fitment issue with the clutch upper roller bearing and the clutch pulley on install. TMy original clutch did not use the Upper Roller Clutch bearing only the clutch hub Roller Clutch bearing. When I tried to use the upper bearing as your original Series 10 has I ran into the same problem as you. The clutch would bind against the lower tub and not rotate. You outer tub is designed to use the upper bearing mine is not. The install write that this forum member added to a support post I was helping him with is done very well. I still believe if you follow his suggestions you will resolve your issue of binding. Believe me I know how frustrating this is it’s very a tight work area. I will just post in his install notes again for reference;

    ""The Service manual download was very helpful because it has a few pictures to show the 1/16"-1/8" gap from the shaft to the clutch face. What this really is telling you is that "if" you get all the three parts (clutch plate- bearing sleeve and cream colored plastic piece with 2 raised projections) to the clutch assembly back in correctly, you will end up with the 1/16"-1/8" gap. I also did my repair by tilting the machine back and working on it in place. Test the fit of each of the 3 pieces seperately so you will have a better idea what you are trying to fit. The cream colored plastic piece with 2 raised projections "seats" into the bottom of the tub. The bearing also seats onto the shaft in the notches. The clutch simply fits on the square shaft. The trick is getting the 3 piece assembly on with every piece seated correctly. By no means impossible, but working in limited space it was the most difficult part to do. Something that I thought of (after the repair) was to actually cut out the sheet metal directly below the clutch. This would allow easy access for the reassembly.’” You will have to rock the clutch pulley back and forth with upward pressure to get the clutch seated properly. You are using your original parts and it should go back together it's just a bear.

    Pics of my clutch;

    One on the left is new clutch and came with the upper roller clutch and works fine in my machine. Clutch on the left is original clutch and worked fine after clean up.





    If I can help on the phone just e-mail me at dh1200s@yahoo.com and I will forward you my phone number. I go into work at 3:30 PM East Coast today. Good luck Rich

    My Original repir notes for clutch removal and maintenance;

    Access and remove the Clutch for maintenance
    Disconnect 120VAC power cord.
    The
    Service Manual for reference. Sears Parts Direct for reference.

    Raise the top of the machine. Insert a flat blade putty knife approximately 2.5” from the left and right sides of the washer top, depress the spring tabs securing machine top to the washer base. See page 33 of the SM for putty knife insertion point.
    Remove the front panel see page 41.
    Tools required;
    3/8 inch socket and socket wrench to remove clutch pulley bolt. Page 47 of the SM
    1/2 inch socket or wrench to loosen Drive Motor tension bolt.
    5/16 nut driver or 5/16 ¼ socket on an extension to remove front panel see page 41 of the SM.
    1. Lean the washer back and blocked in that position for a better reach angle. Rotate 3/8” clutch Pulley Bolt CW to remove clutch bolt.
    2. Follow SM page 46 & 47 to remove clutch pulley.
    3. Remove 4 screws holding plastic cover on clutch, inspect clutch spring to make sure it is not broken. Inspect roller bearings clean up with WD-40 and re-lube with bearing grease.
    4. Replace white bearing plate into clutch pulley hub, insure key slot slips into clutch Spring pin in clutch hub.
    5. Replace Clutch plastic cover with 4 screws.
    6. Reseat clutch on spinner shaft and rock back and forth while lifting clutch with upward pressure to reseat clutch. When seated properly you will feel a 1/16-1/8" gap between the Pulley face and shaft end as mentioned and shown on page 47 of the SM. On reinstallation, tighten Clutch Pulley bolt CCW to 96” pounds 8’ foot pounds (Snug no torque wrench required).
    7. Do a quick wash and make sure clutch runs true with no wobble or clicking sound. If the clutch has not been seated properly it will spin off. If this happens go to page 16 of the SM Board Output Test and turn on Drain Pump in Service Mode to pump out excess water.
    8. Repeat steps 6&7 if the clutch has excessive noise or spins off.


  • dh1200s
    dh1200s Apr 22, 2009

    Hey jpdarrish ,



    I believe if the you still can't see the pics you may have a browser issue. When I viewed this post with my wifes laptop I saw the infamous RED X from MS IE7. Went back to this machine my desk top and pic's view OK in the post.

  • Sandi Hankins Aug 13, 2011

    YOU ROCK~!! My husband was ready to trash our Neptune TL after the appliance repair place he took it to gave us a repair estimate of $350. He had planned to take it to the scrap metal place this weekend. I found this post after doing a Google search and we took the clutch off this morning - it was completely dry. He lubed it up with bearing grease, reinstalled it and now we're back in business! THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!

  • dh1200s
    dh1200s Aug 14, 2011

    Hi txseamonkey,

    I’m glad it worked out for you. I took an e-mail alert from this forum. I don’t post in this forum very much because of the very limited features of this forum.

    I’m an owner like you and have learned a lot form working on the machine. A lot of owners just deep six the machine for Clutch issues……………GOOD FOR YOU!

    Google these text phrases for support I offer on other forums “”Sticky: Neptune TL Washer FAV6800AWW “” got to the 5th post down in that Sticky.

    And this site “”FAV6800A/FAV9800A Outer Tub bearing replacement”” this one is real important because your washer is ready for a Tub Seal replacement. You folks are my kind of DIY'ers...........from what you have done with Clutch maintenance I feel you can handel anything the machine can throw at you. I post as dh1200s on those forums also. Good look……..Rich

  • dh1200s
    dh1200s Aug 14, 2011

    Good look??..Rich That's why I hate this forum can't edit if you fat finger..............Good Luck

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HopelessR

You may not want to hear from me again. This person had similar issues related to a Tub Seal and Outer Tub Bearing noise. I worked with him thru on a Outer Tub bearing, Tub Seal and Clutch replacement.

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I did a lot of off line work with him via e-mail. I'm going to ping him and see if his machine is still in service.

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1 Answer

Codes and holes


Hi mandystreet,
I’m an owner like you; from what you describe I feel you have a clutch issue if you’re machine is a FAV6800AW or FAV9800AW. I'll bet it completes the spin cycle with no clothes in the wash basket. Here is what is happening
See this post for a step by step process to remove the clutch. Try a maintenance clean up of the One-way Roller Clutch bearing and see if that will get you back in service, if not I would do a Clutch replacement.
Your machine is shutting down the spin cycle with dc and UC errors so your Tub Displacement Sensor is working as designed.
From the Service Manual page 12;
During fill cycle – If machine tumbles and spins simultaneously replace clutch assembly.
During spin cycle – If machine tumbles and spins simultaneously replace clutch assembly.
You can check this out by turning off the water supply lines if you check during water fill cycle. Lift the washer top from the base and observe the action during water fill or spin cycle. The Service Manual will show you how to raise the washer top from the base.
This is happening because the clutch One-way Roller Bearings are sticky, slightly rusted. When the machine enters spin cycle the agitator shaft is slightly engaged because the one-way roller clutches are dragging this will cause the agitator shaft to rotate in spin cycle spinning the tumblers slightly. In this condition the wash load is tossed about while the wash basket begins to spin up. This will cause the Tub to become unbalanced and the tub starts making greater swings.
This continues until the TDS (Tub Displacement Sensor) signals an unbalance condition to the Control Board and shuts the cycle down with a dc or UC unbalance errors. If the TDS fails in this mode the machine would likely walk across the floor until it unplugged itself or ended in a self-destruct.… :)
A WD-40 clean up and re-lube may get you back in service. Just follow this posting step by step. If you are not a DIY type direct your service repair to this e-mail to help speed you to repair and control cost. You can redistribute the wash load until the cows come home and you will continue to fail with UC or dc unbalance errors…. Fix the clutch issue and your machine will be happy and so will the owner.
Rich

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1 Answer

Tub rotates CW during agitation, out of balance, hits side of metal cabinet, but no error code



Hello srcoray,

Did you replace the clutch, just trying to get a feel for your hands on experience with the machine? If you did the work did your machine use the upper roller clutch bearing along with the clutch pulley mounted roller clutch bearing?

The FAV6800AW uses a reversing motor and motor controller that powers the motor and clutch pulley to rotate CW in Wash/Agitate cycle and CCW in Spin Cycle.

In Wash/Agitate cycle the roller clutch bearing should rotate freely CW allowing the agitator shaft to drive the transmission in wash cycle driving the tumblers to rotate only not the wash basket. In spin cycle the roller clutch bearing will lock up (one-way roller clutch bearing) driving the spinner shaft to rotate the wash basket and transmission CCW. Unless my thinking is wrong it sounds like the one way roller clutch bearing is frozen or dragging and not rotating freely in wash cycle rotating the wash basket CW. I’m an owner like you and will try to help.

Just a few other questions;

If you have a load of wet clothes in the wash basket and you select Spin Only cycle will the spin cycle complete with out dc/UC errors?

With the lid raised can you rotate the wash basket CW? It should not; it should only rotate CCW and do that with very little resistance.

Rich

May 22, 2009 | Maytag Neptune FAV6800AW Top Load Washer

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