Question about Pioneer Audio & Video Receivers

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Have replaced laser and spindle motor. Tried variouse acjustments. The spindle motor will turn, the traverse will search up and down, it makes the usual noises while the laser is picking up some signals but at the end it does not recognise a disc. We are a service center. I have never been able to get one of these models to work. Am I missing something here? Are there any other common faults causing this problem. Has it to do with alignments? (Have tried variouse settings with no success including stting a different turntable height, adjusting laser to variouse settings etc. Please can you suggest something? Eric Pal Tech Services

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  • service_tsv Sep 04, 2008

    THANKS DAVE



    THE MODEL NUMBER IS PD-M427



    ANOTHER REPLAY WOULD BE APPRICIATED



    ERIC

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If this is a Pioneer CD player, you may need to do a grating adjustment. Do you have the service manual? What model number is this?

I may be able to help you more with this information.

The grating adjustment is needed on many different Pioneer CD players, mostly the older models. There is a smaill area on the pick up with a copper colored plate that must be moved just a little one way or the other. You put a very small flat head screwdriver in and move this copper plate just a little one way and then try again the other way if it doesn't work the first time.

There is a jig set up that Pioneer outlines in the service manual to do this properly. You need an O-scope as well to moniter a point on the jig. I have done this before without using the jig or O-scope, but it is more presise with these things being used.

This procedure needs to be done in the test mode so the disc is spinning constantly and then do the adjustment while watching the O-scope to know when the adjustment is at the proper position.

If this is a model that I have the service manual for, I can outline the procedure very well for you. But first I need to know the proper model number which I did not see in your post.

Let me know,

Dave

Posted on Sep 04, 2008

  • Dave DeGain
    Dave DeGain Sep 04, 2008

    I checked and could not find the service manual for the model you have. I even checked on Pioneers service website and they have no manuals or bullitins for it either.



    The bottom line is I can not give you the details I hoped to have.



    Since this is a 6 disc changer with a magazine, it has the traverse deck (pick-up assembly w/spindle motor) on the top of the cd mech with the pick-up right there with the laser pointed down. This means that you should be able to see the area that needs adjustment very easy and get access to it with out any trouble. As I stated before, there is a small copper colored piece of metal that needs to be adjusted. You can look right at the pick up and see it, it has a notch in it where a small flathead could fit into. That is the spot to use for moving that copper piece inside the pick up. You would then just move that copper piece a very small amount one way, just nudge it a hair, then try playing a disc again. If it doesn't work, nudge it a little more, then try playing a disc again. If it still doesn't work after 3 or 4 nudges, nudge it back the other direction a few times while trying to play a disc in between each nudge of the copper piece.



    If you have changed the spindle hieght and made adjustments to the laser power on the pick up, you may need to have a new pick up and spindle motor if you can't get those things back to the original settings. This adjustment may not work properly if the laser power is too high or too low, or if the spindle table is too high or too low. You can adjust the laser power output by monitoring the eye pattern with an O-scope and then adjust it to about 1.2 volts peak to peak That should put you right where you need to be. The spindle table you will just need to wing it and make sure it doesn't look too far away from the disc when loaded with one.



    I wish I could have had the service manual for it, but I don't. So this is the best information I can give you. You may want to just order one from Pioneer since you said you work on a few of these and could never get them to work. The one-time investment for all the exact information on the grating adjustment would be a great help to you in the future. The service website that I accessed for Pioneer did not have anything on this model, but that is because it is a little too old. They do have hard copy service manuals you can order and have shipped to you. I was looking for a PDF to download which they have lots of, but only back to a certain year. Everything else older is only hard copies.



    I hope this helps, and a good rating would be appreciated.



    Thanks,

    Dave

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Forget solution #1

Here's what you do:

Your Garrard Type A is most likely an idler-drive deck (With a rubber wheel driving the turntable).

- Under the rubber mat there's a "C" shaped clamp to be found around the spindle. Remove that and keep safe. Now remove the platter and behold the 'guts' of the monster. On the left you should see a thick rubber wheel with a metal core inside, directly under that wheel you'll find a 3 step pulley protruding from under the frame.

Plug in the AC and turn on. Carefully look at the pulley. It should spin fast. If not, immediately unplug the power otherwise you'll burn out the motor. If the pulley spins too slow, the specially inserted factory grease/oil may have "set" or dried out during the silent years..

The same goes for the grease/ oil which is inserted in the spindle-bus. We'll get there later.

- Make sure the AC is OFF! High Voltage Inside!

- Lift the frame from its casing/ plinth and make sure it's completely supported when upside down, so you don't damage the arm!

- Locate the BIG motor! :-)

- The lower bearing screws may be 'glued' on with red lacquer. (Shellac) (This was done to prevent repairs by users (Warranty Expiration)
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- Clean it out with a tissue or a non-pilling piece of cloth. The Top bearing can be found under the motor-pulley which is fastened with 3 small screws. (Note! This bearing doesn't need greasing 'cause it's only there for support!)

Once cleaned out insert the tiniest little amount of Singer-Oil (Sowing Machine Oil) into the LOWER bearing. and put it back over the motor shaft. Screw the bearing back on. Make sure the screws are not too tight as, once again you may damage the heads. There! You just re-greased your turntable motor!

Next: If the speed selector lever is hard to move. Apply a small dab of vaseline onto the frame right next to the lever. Gently move it to and fro a few times and that's that.

- Spindle Bus:

This is somewhat more risky because this is practically what makes the turntable! The spindle was inserted in the factory by pressure, oil first, spindle second, forcing all the air out, leaving a film of oil around the spindle-shaft..

- Locate the cast-iron spindle-bus. Almost on top there you'll see a screw somewhere (again sealed with the red shellac)

- Gently try to loosen it. AGAIN: Do NOT use excessive force!
After unscrewing keep it safe.

- Turn the upside down frame over again to its normal position.

- Gently try to lift the spindle out of its bus.
DON'T YANK IT as this piece of stainless steel was crafted with extremely high precision! Then again, the vacuum won't let ya, heheh.

- Degrease with a non-pilling cloth or tissue drenched in thinner/ pure alcohol. Use a pencil and non-pilling cloth to clean out and degrease the spindle bus. Never use tissues as these may tear leaving residue in the spindle bus which decreases performance!

- Now poor some Singer-Oil onto the spindle and a small drop in the spindle-bus. Slowly rotate it between your fingers so the oil can distribute itself all over the spindle.

-Put the spindle back in its bus and let it sink in under its own weight (Get some coffee. Watch the Superbowl, Take a vacation, cause this may take a while!) DO NOT force it in as you may damage either the bus or the spindle!

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- Join turntable back together with spindle and give it a soft spin. (Oil warms up inside spindle bus)

Plug in the AC...

Happy spinning at the right speed! :o)


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1 Answer

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Manually cleaning the lens
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If the cleaning didn’t help, don’t despair just yet. You can see if there’s a problem elsewhere in the unit by using a few simple tricks and tips.
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If the disc starts to spin slowly and doesn’t come up to speed, the spindle motor that’s attached to the turntable platter is a common problem. There could also be a problem with the spindle motor driver controller IC or the power supply regulator that supplies voltage to the driver IC. If the disc starts to spin and then spins really fast, or stops and starts to spin backwards, your problem is the laser pick-up assembly or the servo control circuit. If you continue to have problems after cleaning and checking the other things listed above, you may have a problem with the player's alignment. Of course, one of the problems you'll face checking alignments on a DVD/CD player is that you’re going to need to use an oscilloscope on most of them. If you have the proper tools and equipment, the first thing to look at is the RF pattern of the unit while its playing. It should be a sharp and clear pattern. If it's dull and smeared, then the laser could be weak.
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Hi derek55

Your unit will need a clean and service. The laser moves backwards and forwards on on 2 rails.These rails are notorious for the grease drying out and impeding the traverse of the mechanism. the solution is to strip the unit, remove the rails and clean them, reinsert with new graphite grease to prevent the problem reoccurring. In some cases it may be a faulty interconnect loom to the laser assembly, and in even fewer cases it may be a faulty spindle motor whose bearing tolerances have passed what the transport can cope with. Whilst in there, clean the laser lens with a cotton bud moistened with windex glass cleaner, then polish off any smears or residue left behind.
I am more than happy to answer any other questions you may have about it, please get back to me here, or use the ASK function to go straight to me :) If you are still unsure, have problems, or we need to look at the situation more deeply, then before you give a rating for this advice, hit the ASK button Thanks for using FixYa, If you consider the advice I have given you as sound, a FixYa rating is a great reward for my efforts to help you. Cheers.

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1 Answer

Dr Dray would like further assistance robotek!


no worries mate... firstly, remeber that mains voltages can kill and you should always disconnect the unit from the power before taking the covers of and work safe.
What we plan to do is to
  1. Clean dried grease from the worm drive gear that move the laser optics back and forth.
  2. Clean the laser lens
  3. lube the spindle motor bearings
You will need

cotton buds
methylated spirits
light oil
fine sewing needle

Using a cotton bud moistened with metho, clean the the old dried grease of the worm drive gear. Removing the laser transport from the unit is often the best way to do this. Be sure to not touch any of the connections to the laser itself if you unplug it from the main board. They are very electrostatic sensitive, and can be damaged by the static charge on your person. Be meticulous to clean it well. I use light oil(sewing machine) or if you have it, some graphite grease to then relube it. Apply a drop of oil to the top bearing of the spindle motor (use a fine needle with the oil in the eye to get under the platter to do this. Clean the laser lens with a moistened cotton bud and then polish with a dry one to be sure there is no residue.

Reassemble the unit and see how it goes. If you have any more dramas, a replacement laser assembly can be got and basically plugged into these units with no extra setup. I reccomend using a marantz original if you can . It is described as a cdm12.1 transport. Let me know how you go.

regards
robotek

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1 Answer

Cd player fault quick fix any one?


You can do a few things to see what may happen.
  1. Check the spindle height. The platters sometimes slip down the shaft, or the spindle motor bearing drops and the platter gets closer to the lens.
  2. check that the spindle motor has not become lazy and "poling". give it a few spins. then try to read a disc again.
  3. Clean the laser lens with a cotton wool bud moist with windex glass cleaner. Then "polish the lens with a dry one.
  4. the spindle motor top bearing is worn and the payer mistracks as the armature moves about under the changing drive conditions. Makes the player mistrack and skip. More likely to happen at the start of a disc, because the disc is spinning fastest whilst reading the TOC.
A drop of light machine oil from a syringe oiler can help the bearing to spin an not produce the knock. Only a short term fix to give the motor a "lube". Once the oil leaches out of the worn bearing the problem will return. I have run motors immersed in an oil bath to rejuvenate them before... but better to replace it anyway if its suss at all. Good luck, You could bump my profile by giving me a "FixYa" rating for my sharing my "knowhow". Any problems check back with me here.

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