What is the general procedure for checking timing statically on a points ignition system. When should the points open and when should they close. I understand that they stay closed for a relatively long time
An expert who has achieved level 3 by getting 1000 points
An expert that got 10 achievements.
An expert that got 5 achievements.
An expert whose answer got voted for 500 times.
Re: timin g question
And its the momentary opening of the points that causes the spark. Also.... my points seem fine but there is some blackening/charring on the shaft they make contact with... can I dress it with steel wool so the electrical contact is good again?
It seems as though my points are opening up at the full advance mark. Also should the igntion be turned on while checking timing (not the engine running just the battery in the circuit). When I turn off the ignition and check it the continuity buzzer on my multimeter is going off all the time... it *never* shows an open contact. yet the bike runs,The easiest way to do this is to use an Analog Ohm meter. If your meter uses a tone that's fine too. When you use your ohm meter, you want the system to be discharged and isolated ... that means you want to remove the battery !!! When you check points timing statically, you are only checking for resistance. One ohmmeter lead should be connected to a good ground (on the engine preferably) and the other lead should connected to the wire leading to the coil.
When you rotate the engine, (IN THE PROPER DIRECTION! Wink ) you need to pay attention to the ohmmeter. The exact instant the needle jumps to infinite resistance, that's the place your plug fires. (the exact moment the points open, in other words) This should occur on a designated place that is engraved on the points plate .. (usually maked with an F.) The other marking here usually indicate T for tdc, and usually || for full advance.
Be sure that you are not timing the bike 180 degrees out. Also, be very careful while timing - USE A PROPER SIZED SCREWDRIVER! to prevent stripping a screw head (Which are a PIA to replace.)
A 6ya expert can help you resolve that issue over the phone in a minute or two.
Best thing about this new service is that you are never placed on hold and get to talk to real repairmen in the US.
The service is completely free and covers almost anything you can think of (from cars to computers, handyman, and even drones). click here to download the app (for users in the US for now) and get all the help you need. Good luck!
- If you need clarification, ask it in the comment box above.
- Better answers use proper spelling and grammar.
- Provide details, support with references or personal experience.
Tell us some more! Your answer needs to include more details to help people.You can't post answers that contain an email address.Please enter a valid email address.The email address entered is already associated to an account.Login to postPlease use English characters only.
Tip: The max point reward for answering a question is 15.
point gap should be around .021-.025" and timing should be set at 10 degrees BTDC static
using feeler gauges is always difficult to get it right so use a dwell meter as that is what point gap is all about
the angle of revolutions that allow maximum amount of time for the field current to saturate the coil and produce the highest voltage possible for the plugs
check that the condenser is not shorting out at the points
to check the system pull the coil lead out of the distributor cap and turn on the ignition
then using something insulated open the points manually
there should be a spark at the points and a spark from the ft lead to ground ( head , block etc )
If there is no spark across the points then they are shorting out and you need to check for insulated installation
to do a static timing, place the crank mark at 10 degrees btdc, turn on the ignition and move the distributor body until the points just open ( noise or spark across the points ) lock the distributor down at that point and that will be 10 degreess on the timing light at idle ( 650--750 rpm manual , 850--950 auto)
A new timing chain will not affect ignition timing unless the chain is incorrectly installed then the whole engine is out of time. Why not state what the problem is instead of a generic question like you posted.
electronic ignition will beat points hands down any time
to understand this you will need an explanation of how each works.
with a points system there are a set of points , a condenser and a coil
when the points are closed the current flows through the coil windings and produces a field flux
when the points open this field id collapsed and that produces the high voltage for the spark ( understand that current has mass and when the points open the current still flows and that is absorbed in the condenser-- that continuing current flow acts like an arc welder and burns the points )
to make this collapse happen faster the condenser back feeds current through the coil windings and so the voltage is boosted from 12 volts to around 17,000 volts
This relative low voltage induces a high current flow which over a short operating time burns the center electrode of plugs away , requiring frequent plug gap adjustments and plug replacements
problems associated with points include
point gap constantly closing from the wear block being worn away
point bounce at high rpms
coil flux saturation falling off at high rpms reducing the intensity of the spark
water and moisture in the distributor causing loss of spark
on the other hand with electronic ignition there is no points to
no condenser to fail
the electronic system works on a much lower voltage ( 5-7 volts) and a pulse that initiates the action in an electronic circuit that is controlled by transistors and capacitors
This allows for a more rapid increase and decrease in the coil field flux and that increases the voltage to the vicinity of 60,000 volts
this reduces the current across the plug gap and that results in longer plug life and no change in plug gap settings ( EFI systems using quality plugs will never need changing of the plugs from electrode loss)
as electronic systems are sealed there is no problem from water as there is with points , although the same problem remains with moisture in the distributor cap
Now we have a low voltage spark with high current flow to ignite the mixture against a very high voltage with low current flow to do the job
to make it even better some electronic systems will actually continue a series of sparks so that the flame in the mixture is continually being ignited as against the one spark from a points system ( the air fuel mixture is not static but continually rotates -swirls in the combustion chamber)
what does this mean
better economy at higher rpms
better burn rate of the mixture producing power for all of the power stroke
with ECM units that control the ignition , it also controls the ignition timing according to rpms , and throttle setting and mixture setting reducing the need to alter the spark timing for different fuel octane ratings and altitude conditions as it is done automatically to suit the reports from all the sensors
So as I said
electronic system win hands down over points every time
C CLASS (1993-1997), E CLASS (1995-1997), SLK (1996-) Procedure 1. Point the remote control at the receiver - this should be located in the driver's door handle or next to the boot lock button. 2. Press the lock/unlock button. 3. Within 30 seconds manually lock or unlock the vehicle using the passenger's door lock or the boot lock. Alternative method Procedure 1. Point the remote control at the receiver - this should be located in the driver's door handle or next to the boot lock button. 2. Press the lock/unlock button. 3. Within 30 seconds, switch the ignition ON. Alternative method Procedure 1. Point the remote control at the receiver - this should be located in the driver's door handle or next to the boot lock button. 2. Press the lock/unlock button. 3. Within 30 seconds, turn the ignition switch to position II.
1. Place key in ignition lock and turn to position 2 [all ignition lights on] 2: Turn key to off position and remove from ignition. 3. Within 10 seconds: 3a: press the Close
[Lock] button and hold it down 3b: while the Close button is
still depressed simultaneously press the Open [Unlock] button. Press and release
the Open button 5 times [still holding the Close button down] 3c: Release both the Close and the Open buttons at the same
time, and immediately push any of the two Open buttons once [i.e. either the
Open doors or the Open Tailgate]
information is for the resetting of a previously synchronised key to match the
security system after batteries have been removed or replaced. This information
does not work with new keys which it seems must be taken to a person with a key
synchronisation device [or a super-ripoff-expensive MB dealer]
To begin with, a 1994 Evolution powered Road King did not come from the factory with a points type ignition. It came with a solid state ignition system. Harley went to a solid state ignition in their Big Twin engines in 1979. If your's has points in it, it has been converted to that system. So, I'll simply explain how an ignition system works in a general manner.
When you turn the ignition switch on, voltage is supplied to the primary windings in the coil. This voltage builds up a magnetic field. When the points, or the Hall effect sensor in the case of an electronic ignition system, breaks the circuit ground, the magnetic field collapses inducing a high voltage low current pulse in the secondary windings of the coil. This pulse goes to the spark plug via the spark plug wires where it jumps the gap between the spark plug's center electrode and the ground electrode.
Now, in a points type system, the ignition timing must be advanced by means of a mechanical advance unit where the electronic ignition uses electronic circuitry to advance the timing according the RPM of the engine.
Typically for small outboards.. that era and for many many years after.. use a Flywheel ignition System. a Magneto, Coil, Condenser and Points..
Most of those parts are located on the Magneto stator plate under the magneto "cap". Magnets rotate past the static coil.. hence stator..
The Magneto/Magnets rotate past the coil creating an electric current.. The condenser controls the volatage spikes or modulates the voltage directing the correct voltage to the spark plug. The Points open and close allowing the voltage when closed to travel to the spark plug at the proper time as in or during Compression Stroke / Power stroke.. Which is why timing is so important..
This is a very basic description.. proper operation depends on all parts being in good condition and the timing being set correctly.. good fuel and air supply.. not to forget a proper operating spark plug gapped correctly.
There are youtube videos (of course there is) on how to check the various components of early outboards..coil. condenser.. points etc..
.45mm or 18 thou . Set them when the rubbing block of the points are on the highest part of the lobe. Reset the ignition timing after setting the points as points setting changes the timing. Use a strobe light or if you dont have one you can do it statically . Put the engine on its timing mark on the front pulley not tdc. loosen the distributor turn the ignition on and slowly rotate the dissy until you hear the small tic of the points opening and the spark jumping. at this point re tighten the dissy. That should do the trick If this helps Please Vote Jeff
Revised Timing Chain, Sprocket, and Tensioner Removal Procedure
Note: GM does not provide timing chain timing marks, or information to perform timing chain service without the special tools shown in this procedure.
Email me for complete instructions at rejakwilson @ aol .com
The ignition timing is CDI ignition, pre-set at the factory. You can't change it. The valve timing is the only timing you can do and that is done by lining up the static cam timing mark and the timing mark on the flywheel.
If you simply installed the cam chain on the gear without paying attention to the position of the crank and the position of the cam then the valves are likely not opening and closing at the correct time. Too far off and the piston can hit the valves and bend them and possibly crack the valve guides.
Check a service manual. Cam chain timing procedures will be shown in the manual.