Re: should the car start without alternator,waterpump and...
When you replaced the cam gear did you make sure that the timing marks where in line? If so than yes you should be able to start the engine providing all of the components are installed (ie.) the timing cover,new front seal(recomend you do this),crankshaft balancer,intake manifold,valve covers, etc. you should not need to install the alternater,power steering pump,waterpump and other accessaries at this point.
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Crankshaft Position - Camshaft Position Correlation
What does this mean?
OBD Code P0016refers to
The crankshaft position sensor (CKP) and Camshaft position sensor (CMP) work in harmony to control the spark/fuel delivery and timing. They both consist of a reluctor, or tone, ring which passes over a magnetic sensor, which generates a voltage, indicating position. The crankshaft sensor is part of the primary ignition system and functions as the "trigger". It detects the position of the crankshaft relays that information on to the PCM or the ignition module (depending on the vehicle) to control spark timing. The Camshaft position sensor detects the position of the camshafts and relays the information to the PCM. The PCM uses the CMP signal to identify the beginning of the injector sequence. What ties these two shafts and their sensors together is the timing belt or chain. The cam and crank should be precisely timed together. If the PCM detects that the Crank and Cam signals are out of time by a specific number of degrees, this P0016 code will set.
Possible sumptoms of OBD code P0016
Malfunction Indicator Lamp (MIL) illumination The engine may run but with reduced performance The engine may crank but not start The engine may exhibit a rattle near the harmonic balancer indicating the tone ring is damaged The engine may start and run, but poorly
Possible causes of OBD code P0016
Timing chain stretched, or timing belt skipped a tooth due to wear Misalignment of timing belt/chain Tone ring on crankshaft slipped/broken Tone ring on camshaft slipped/broken Bad crank sensor Bad cam sensor Damaged wiring to crank/cam sensor Timing belt/chain tensioner damaged
First, visually inspect the cam and crank sensors and their harnesses for damage. If you notice broken/frayed wires, repair and recheck. If you have access to a scope, check the cam and crank patterns. If a pattern is missing, suspect a bad sensor or a slipping tone ring. Remove the cam gear and the crankshaft harmonic balancer and inspect the tone rings for proper alignment and make sure they're not loose or damaged or that they haven't sheared the key that aligns them. If they are properly installed, replace the sensor. If the signal appears normal, then check the timing chain/belt for proper alignment. If it's misaligned, check for a damaged tensioner that may have allowed the chain/belt to slip a tooth or several teeth. Also check that the belt/chain isn't stretched. Repair and recheck.
Causes Causes may include: Timing chain stretched, or timing belt skipped a tooth due to wear Misalignment of timing belt/chain Tone ring on crankshaft slipped/broken Tone ring on camshaft slipped/broken Bad crank sensor Bad cam sensor Damaged wiring to crank/cam sensor Timing belt/chain tensioner damaged An improperly torqued crankshaft balancer A mis-built or mis-timed engine A loose or missing crankshaft balancer bolt The CMP actuator solenoid stuck open The CMP actuator stuck in a position other than 0 degrees.
This ai a pretty complex repair, the a/c compressor needs to be removed, the alternator, power steering pump. Everything that is in the front of the engine that is driven by the belt. Waterpump romoval, and finally the timing cover. A good repair manual will be good idea. Check that out about 25 bucks or so at local Autozone. The timing chain has to time the cranlshaft and camshaft' To #1 top dead center, on the compression stroke.
for gti engine , you will need a timing tool
this one has both timing belt and chain, first you need to line up the chain and it will require the timing tool .
for the belt there should be two marks one on the cam sproket and one on the crank sproket. you will have to line up the marks with ( OT).
very old post.
that code is in the FSM buy an FSM
or log in to alldata.com and see true meaning,
i believe this is unique to suzuki and only your car./engine and body.
3.6L v6 , the pregnant version of my 2.5L
change the water pump on this engine sux.. big time.
Crankshaft Position - Camshaft Position Correlation Bank 1 Sensor "B" Number of Trips to Set Code: 2 Trouble Code Conditions:
Difference between camshaft (bank 1 / exhaust side) position and crankshaft position is out of specified range. Possible Causes:
Timing chain tensioner
loose chain? or the can be a dead (jammed) tensioner.
if crazy loose it can skip a sproket tooth, do you ignore chain noise?
Water pump bearing faulty is first thought. How about faulty alternator/battery? you didn't mention any check engine lights that were on. Alternator bearings can fail, creating a no-charge situation that will run your battery dead, creating a "no power to injectors and no start situation"... if your waterpump is locked up, it can keep your belt from operating other accessories. Waterpump first choice.
Timing chain stretched, or timing belt skipped a tooth due to wear
Misalignment of timing belt/chain
Tone ring on crankshaft slipped/broken
Tone ring on camshaft slipped/broken
Bad crank sensor
Bad cam sensor
Damaged wiring to crank/cam sensor
Timing belt/chain tensioner damaged
First, visually inspect the cam and crank sensors and their harnesses for damage.
If you notice broken/frayed wires, repair and recheck.
If you have access to a scope, check the cam and crank patterns. If a pattern is
missing, suspect a bad sensor or a slipping tone ring. Remove the cam gear and the
crankshaft harmonic balancer and inspect the tone rings for proper alignment and
make sure they're not loose or damaged or that they haven't sheared the key that
aligns them. If they are properly installed, replace the sensor.
If the signal appears normal, then check the timing chain/belt for proper
alignment. If it's misaligned, check for a damaged tensioner that may have allowed
the chain/belt to slip a tooth or several teeth. Also check that the belt/chain
isn't stretched. Repair and recheck.
1. Depressurize and drain the cooling system.
2. Loosen the alterantor adjustment and remove the belt.
3. Remove the water pump pulley. 4. Remove all the timing belt covers.
5. Loosen the timing (camshaft) belt tensioner and slip the timing belt off the
camshaft toothed pulley (ensure you do not move the positon of the camshaft)
6. Unbolt the lower radiator hose fitting and heater retrun pipe. 7. Unbolt the waterpump from the block (5 bolts).
8. Remove all traces of the old gasket before mounting the new pump
(Permatex spray on gasket remover works well).
9. Install the new pump and reassemble in reverse order to above.
This is a job for an experienced technician. Probably about a $300 job. Maybe more.
Here is procedure for 1996:
Drain the cooling system. Refer to Section 03-03 for the procedure.
Disconnect the battery ground cable (14301).
Remove the generator drive belt, water pump and power steering pump drive belt, and the A/C compressor drive belt (if equipped). Refer to Section 03-05 for the removal procedure.
If equipped, remove the three A/C compressor drive belt idler pulley bolts and the A/C compressor drive belt idler pulley.
Remove the upper radiator hose bracket bolt.
Loosen the two upper radiator hose clamps and remove the radiator hose bracket bolt. Remove the upper radiator hose (8260) and the upper radiator hose bracket from the vehicle.
Remove the water bypass hose (8597) from between the thermostat housing and the water hose connection (8592).
Remove the main wiring harness from the upper engine front cover (6019).
Remove the eight upper engine front cover bolts and the upper engine front cover.
Raise and support the vehicle.
Remove the RH front wheel and tire assembly.
Remove the four RH outer engine and transmission splash shield bolts and two screws and remove the RH outer engine and transmission splash shield (6775).
Use Strap Wrench D85L-6000-A or equivalent to hold the water pump pulley (8509) while removing the four water pump pulley bolts.
Remove the water pump pulley from the water pump (8501).
Remove the crankshaft pulley (6312). Refer to the procedure in this section.
Remove the five lower engine front cover bolts and the lower engine front cover.
Ensure that the timing marks between the crankshaft sprocket (6306) and the oil pump housing line up.
18. NOTE: The directional arrow is necessary to ensure that the timing chain/belt (6268) can be reinstalled in the same direction.
If the timing chain/belt is to be reused, mark the direction of rotation on the timing chain/belt.
19. Loosen the timing chain/belt tensioner nut.
Remove the timing chain/belt.
Installation NOTE: Ensure that the timing marks on the camshaft sprockets (6256) and the seal plate are properly aligned. Ensure that the timing marks on the crankshaft sprocket and the oil pump housing are still aligned.
CAUTION: Pay special attention to the tooth shape of the timing belt. The current timing belts are not interchangeable with the timing belts from the 1993 model year. The 1993 model year uses a square or trapezoidal tooth timing belt while the current model year uses a rounded tooth design. The design change was made to extend the service life of the timing belt from 60,000 miles for the square or trapezoidal toothed belt to 105,000 miles for the rounded tooth belt. If the proper timing belt is not used, the customer may complain of a "whining" noise coming from the engine compartment. If the camshaft sprocket has a square cut in the valley of the gear tooth, it will require a square or trapezoidal tooth timing belt. If the camshaft sprocket has a rounded cut in the valley of the gear tooth, it will require a rounded tooth timing belt. NOTE: If a new timing chain/belt is to be installed, make sure that the arrow is pointing away from the engine. If a timing chain/belt is to be reused, make sure that the directional arrow that was marked during disassembly is facing the correct direction.
NOTE: A new timing chain/belt has three white timing marks that indicate the correct timing positions of the camshafts and the crankshaft. These marks will help ensure that the engine (6007) is timed properly. When the engine is properly timed each white timing mark on the timing chain/belt will be aligned with the corresponding camshaft and crankshaft timing mark on the sprocket. Because the white timing marks are not evenly spaced you will need to refer to the following illustration for proper timing chain/belt placement. There should be 40 timing belt teeth between the timing marks of the front and rear camshaft sprockets and 43 teeth between the timing mark on the front camshaft sprocket and the timing mark on the crankshaft sprocket.
NOTE: Verify that the camshaft timing marks are aligned with the timing marks on the seal plate, and that the crankshaft sprocket timing mark is aligned with the timing mark on the oil pump (6600).
Install the timing chain/belt starting at the crankshaft sprocket and moving around to the camshaft sprockets following a counterclockwise path. Do not allow any slack in the timing chain/belt between the timing sprockets. After all of the timing marks are matched up with the timing chain/belt installed, slip the timing chain/belt onto the timing chain/belt tensioner.
While holding the timing chain/belt tensioner with an Allen wrench, loosen the timing chain/belt tensioner nut.
Allow the timing chain/belt tensioner to put pressure on the timing chain/belt.
Use an Allen wrench to turn the timing chain/belt tensioner 70-80 degrees clockwise and tighten the timing chain/belt tensioner nut to 43-58 Nm (32-43 lb-ft).
Rotate the crankshaft (6303) clockwise twice and align the No. 1 piston to Top Dead Center (TDC) on its compression stroke.
Apply 98N (22 lbs) of force on the timing chain/belt between the rear camshaft sprocket and the timing chain/belt tensioner.
NOTE: An assistant may be needed to adjust the timing chain/belt.
While holding the timing chain/belt tensioner steady with an Allen wrench, loosen the timing chain/belt tensioner nut. Remove the Allen wrench and adjust the timing chain/belt tensioner as follows:
Install a 0.35mm (0.0138 inch) thick and 12.7mm (0.500 inch) wide feeler gauge as shown.
Turn the crankshaft clockwise to position the feeler gauge between the timing chain/belt tensioner and the timing chain/belt
Tighten the timing chain/belt tensioner nut to 43-58 Nm (32-43 lb-ft).
Turn the crankshaft clockwise to remove the feeler gauge from between the timing chain/belt tensioner and the timing chain/belt.
Rotate the crankshaft clockwise twice and align the No. 1 piston to TDC on its compression stroke.
Apply 98N (22 lbs) of force on the timing chain/belt between the rear and front camshaft sprocket.
Measure the timing chain/belt deflection. Timing chain/belt deflection should be between 13-15mm (0.51-0.59 inch). If timing chain/belt deflection is not within specification, repeat steps 3-11. If the timing chain/belt cannot be adjusted to within specification, the timing chain/belt will have to be replaced.
Position the lower engine front cover and install the five lower engine front cover bolts. Tighten the five lower engine front cover bolts to 3-5 Nm (27-44 lb-in).
Install the outer timing chain/belt guide and the crankshaft pulley. Refer to the procedure in this section.
Position the water pump pulley on the water pump and install the four water pump pulley bolts
Use Strap Wrench D85L-6000-A or equivalent to hold the water pump pulley, and tighten the four water pump pulley bolts to 16-21 Nm (12-15 lb-ft).
Position the RH outer engine and transmission splash shield and install the four RH outer engine and transmission splash shield bolts and two screws.
Install the RH front wheel and tire assembly. Tighten the lug nuts (1012) to 98-118 Nm (72-87 lb-ft).
This is a serious repair job (I've done it several times) and a real
beast for the typical driveway mechanic. It's nothing like the
simplicity of a fan or alternator belt. It's inside the engine!
A $50 part and 10 hrs of labor. A sure way to kill a weekend (if everything goes well)
The front engine cover, housing the waterpump, etc must come off (usually the radiator, etc is in the way)
The relationship between the position of the crankshaft and camshaft is
critical (these 2 major rotating parts are connected by the toothed
timing belt. One notch off during re-assembly and the car will never
run right if it even starts.
Buy a good shop manual (factory is best but aftermarket is OK) and examine the steps before deciding to take on this tough job.