Question about 1994 Toyota 4Runner

22 Answers

Cold performance problem

1994 toyota 4runner 4wd, v6, 350k mi., manual trans. new long block w/15k mi.

1. engine starts fine, idles fine,
2. warm up takes 10 minutes.
3. vehicle does not drive well unless warmed up, actually it is very hard to get out of driveway with small incline.
4. when cold must slip clutch, use hi rpm to get vehicle to move.
4a. it reminds one of driving an old car with a manual choke that is too far out, or one with a stuck choke.
5. gas pedal is very stiff until warmed up. very difficult to depress.
5a. when warm, gas pedal is better but still not the easiest to depress (this has always been the case)
6. when backing off of gas there is gurgling out of tail pipe.
7. when you slightly depress the gas pedal and quickly let off you can hear a slight gurgle pop in the tail pipe.
8. there are no idiot lights on.
9. there seems to be a decided lack of acceleration power when cruising at high speed.
10. when going up hill (I live in the mountains) in 4th the speed is slowly lost with the accelerator pedal to the floor.
have to downshift to 3rd and pick speed back up. which it does fine.





Posted by on

  • 29 more comments 
  • dkgeneralmai Nov 06, 2008

    a complete overhaul was just performed 15k mi ago.

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 06, 2008

    vehicle has been up and down this mountain since '94, oil thickness ? change reg maintenance sked every 3/5k miles 10w30.
    everything ran fine after new long block, then slowly began to degrade until warmed up.
    please, do not post unless you are a real toyota mechanic with experience on performance issue.
    thanks

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 06, 2008

    this is not an oil issue, this is a component issue. oil would not cause the accelerator pedal to be very stiff when cold and then lose when it warms up. like i said the vehicle has been garage up here since i bought it in '94. same oil wt. no problem.

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 06, 2008

    the last post doesn't seem to apply to my vehicle.
    it starts fine, battery is new, please read the post

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 06, 2008

    thanks, i had a problem a few months back and had an expert can't remember his name, he nailed it. that is why i have returned. i will wait for and expert, i assume that i have to keep answering these post as they come along to repost or do i just let the useless ones hang ? thanks again

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 06, 2008

    right

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 06, 2008

    this answer has nothing to do with my post.

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 06, 2008

    Well, patience is a virtue, but I was about to give up on mine, I was waiting for your note, so thanks.


    So, Here we go...Before I can get you a viable solution, I need some clarifications from you:
    First, the warm-up issue. Where is the temp gauge when you drive, does it ride at 1/2 way up after 10 minutes? YES
    Sticking throttle: Easy fix
    Popping noises: Please explain how you set the timing, if you have done so... there is a special procedure necessary to accomplish this.
    I had a pro shop install the long block. everything seemed fine with the way it ran. it seemed to slowly degrade. I had in into a shop up here, (compedent, but certianly not Toyota tech's}. I had asked him to check the timing, he said that he could not get a good reading on the scope when he connected at the two points, something to that effect. I didn't understand what he was saying. He also said that he noticed that the accelerator pedal was stiff, saw that a "rod" was bent and "strightened it out" that seems to make it much easier for awhile (it has always been stiff) but now in the mornings it is damm near impossible to push to the floor. So on the timing issue i am at a loss. (my plan was to get some advice here before taking it into a better shop, down the hil, and have the work done)


    Power on hills: Does the tach increase as the mph slows? NO, I don't believe it does, if i recall it stays the same.
    Idiot light: Does the check engine light illuminate with the key at the "on" position? YES
    Get this stuff back to me, and I will assist you. Please ignore most of the others, they have no clue as to what they are talking about.

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 06, 2008

    yes, if figured that was part of the equation. I would like to have an idea of what is going on with the other issues before i take it in. (I want to have enough knowledge to defeat any pitch for a new "circuit board" or some such pitch. I appreciate your response, and await other meaningful solutions. thanks

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 06, 2008

    waiting for toyata ed. thanks

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 06, 2008

    looking for the post from toyota Ed. it doesn't show up on the thread. help me find it. thanks

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 07, 2008

    electech, that sounds plausible. waiting for post from toyota ed. thanks

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 07, 2008

    thanks ginko

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 07, 2008

    send the link again. something seems to be wrong with the way i see the posts. most of it is not there after clicking on the email link. please send the link to the full thread again. sorry for the hassle.

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 07, 2008

    I keep getting email that there is a new post. when i go to the link it is the same as before.
    can someone send me a link so i can see the full thread ? i would greatly appreciate it.

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 07, 2008

    all the ignition wires were replace with the long block rebuild. thanks

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 07, 2008

    thanks i will try that.

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 07, 2008

    yeah ok.

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 07, 2008

    ok found toyota ed's stuff.

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 07, 2008

    ok, still reading the posts. thanks

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 07, 2008

    ok still checking all the posts. somehow i have to repost each time to see a new post, comment, then repost, anyway. thanks

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 07, 2008

    new thermostat, water pump on rebuild
    stock engine size, same std trans, same flywheel
    timing seems to be the issue,
    i don't know about the injectors it stock

    thanks for all the tips

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 07, 2008

    I purchased the long block from a usa rebuilder so i assume it is a domestio mkt block. but i will get this stuff to the tech. I am trying to get up enough info so i can do some of the check myself and then have some idea what to talk to him about. i appreciate all the tips, i wish i could find a way to see them all, i only can see them after the email notice then they disappear. i have logged into the homepage; then my support profile; then my premium problem; but all that shows up is my comments; wierd. i will email support, see if they can help. thanks again.

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 07, 2008

    good read, thanks thanks thanks IrishDruid

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 07, 2008

    i believe he was refering to the posts at the beginning of the thread that were obviously inane.
    thanks

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 07, 2008

    original motor went at 334k. history of cat changed every 120k mile or so. it is v6. there is no smell or other to indicate the cat. i had it into cat shop to weld/repair break in line. he seemed to think that cat was fine. i am going to go check each of the items suggested in the posts, (those that i cut and pasted, i still can't see any posts except mine) and i will post the results. I sure appreciate the help. thanks doug

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 07, 2008

    no comment

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 07, 2008

    right

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 08, 2008

    no comment

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 08, 2008

    right

  • dkgeneralmai Nov 08, 2008

    nc

×

22 Answers

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Has anyone considered that the burrble sound is a noise made by tight valve clearances Engineer may have shaved too much off during recon and now have a tight valve issue.

Posted on Nov 08, 2008

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Hi, This definitely has to be one of the fluids which explains multiple symptoms you have mentioned.
This could be either engine oil, transmission oil etc ...
Also try rechecking the brakes. May be the brakes are already (almost) holding the wheels. So during cold climate, brake shoes expands and holds the wheel making it difficult to pump in more energy to get it moving.

When you talk about cold climate, what kind of temperature are you talking about (or) where are you from?
:)

Posted on Nov 08, 2008

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Toyota ed what a laugh, thanks for trying, fot these other people stealing money and trying to make there self feel good, if the customer is satisfied w/ the solution and it fixes there problem are they really stealing there money, for such a big shot, you didn't do much better. try replacing the throttle body, and sorry for all the incompetent people such as myself, 99.99% of the time our input is free and very much appreciated. sir, i hope you find a viable solution to your answer, best regards tha brain

Posted on Nov 08, 2008

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Problem in your engine belt(a rubber belt)

Posted on Nov 07, 2008

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Check ur coil in motor

Posted on Nov 07, 2008

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Ok ill give it a try......... sounds like a cloged catylitic converter......... why was the original motor changed???? explains the power loss and lag in fourth gear....... ill do some more checking on this and get back........ also great post leetamara!!!!!!! we are here trying to help and get the satifaction of knowing things get fixed.

Posted on Nov 07, 2008

  • Jimmy
    Jimmy Nov 07, 2008

    what engine ???? sorry if i didnt see it

  • Jimmy
    Jimmy Nov 07, 2008

    found some fixes for the egr valve, restricted fuel injectors, oil fouled 02 sensor conectors causing voltage bleed over,and the mass airflow sensor for the 2.4l engine on the 3.0 sounds like a short in harness by the egr tube and possible 02 sensors.... coolant sensor slow to react, poor grounds, bad dowel pin on distributor........... let me know if you need any more info justuscc

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Dont know if you got to see all the solutions, so I am posting here again *hoping* that you get to read them all:

Comment by Toyota Ed: Ok. What you have are several issues. Let me tackle them one by one.
TIMING: The base timing should be 10 degress BTDC. To properly set the timing, you or your tech needs to JUMP terminals "E1" and "Te1", in the small box under the hood. Then connect the timing light, and set it to 10 degrees. If this setting can NOT be acheived with motion of the distributor, as I suspect, you have a timing belt that is off one tooth. This will explain the popping and gurgling sounds. In regards to the throttle being stiff, I would suggest to you to remove the tube going from the air cleaner box to the throttle plate/throttle body area. This is the circular flapper where the gas pedal cable connects to the engine. Remove the tube, and inspect the interior of the throttle plate area, It should be VERY clean, and shiny. If it is very dirty, black & crusty, clean it with good carb cleaner. Here is a real good test: the cable to the throttle bodyu is easily removed. Take the cable off, and manually open the throttle valve...Does it still stick? If so, this is where you need to start. Keep cleaning it until it is spotless. Remove the screw on top of the throttle plate and spray cleaner down into the hole. Replace the screw, start it up, and reset the screw to reset your base idle. Post back if you desire additional information. Most of this should really benefit you. Glad to be able to provide you with my professional assistance.

Tripleauto:
As far as your throttle, You need to unhook the throttle cable and manually move the throttle plate if it eases up then your cable is binding. fix this with a new cable. if it is still hard to open then you have som bent linkage or the bore has been messed up somejow and will need to be replaced.The popping back thru exhaust sounds like you may also have a timing issue could be just slightly off

Benimur:
A possible reason for the need to downshift on a rise is a light flywheel, did you change the transmission as well? As to your other concerns:

  • warmup, 10 minutes - have you checked the thermostat. maybe stuck in open position?
  • small incline, slip clutch. high RPM - all indicates an underpowered engine or engine to drivetrain mismatch;
  • gurgling and popping sound - air/fuel mixture, I am inclined to think on the lean side; or
  • timing a bit of retarded, might need to be 17*btdc base; or
  • have you tried larger injectors (330cc @ 41/43psi)
ToyotaEd has presented to you the timing procedures and he suggested 10 degrees. Perhaps you could verify/set the timing as he prescribed.

If on the other hand, the replacement engine is a JDM (Japanese Domestic Model), might I suggest the 17 degrees. Most JDM's are restricted/detuned hence my suggestion of advancing.

Incidentally, have you tried swapping the sensors from the old engine to the replacement engine. It is possible that the temp threshold of the new engine is different with the old and the engine's computer is getting erroneous signals and therefore sending wrong triggers.

Posted on Nov 07, 2008

  • Swilin Sampson
    Swilin Sampson Nov 07, 2008

    electech1:
    just something else you will want to do:

    check and clean MAFM ( mass air flow meter) and TPS ( throttle position
    sensor) as these sensors are important to the computer and timming ,
    also they can effect the transmision shifting or hesitation let alone
    the running conditions

    here is a cool place that will show how to do a test on the tps sensor http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTricks/...

    a MAFM (mass air flow meter) can fool the computer in believing there
    is more air than there is or less air than there is causing the engine
    not to work properly sometimes cleaning it helps but others then have
    to be replaced

    Robotek:
    I would have somebody floor on the accelerator pedal, and go check that
    you are getting full throttle at the butterfly. May be the stiff
    throttle, is actually not allowing you to get the peddle to the metal.

    Scott Ellin:
    The first thing you should do is give the throttle chamber a good cleaning.
    That is very handy & could very well solve the problem.



    Second try, using an injector cleaner


    Third try, A light tapping is probably harmless. Quiet valves, if they are mechanical, could mean trouble.



    Fourth one, I heard of an instance where the remote starter
    didn't start the car. After lots of work by the dealer, many
    replacements etc, it was found that it was the battery. They replaced
    the battery and all was well.

    Paul_H_357:
    I would think after reading all the solutions that you would have fixed
    the throttle problem.. Disconnect and move it to see if it was the
    cable or the carb linkage that was stiff and spray with WD40 to free it up..

    I'am trying to help with the poor performance..If no knocks on start up, oil is good and just runs crappy....Hmmm.

    Timing is lets say pretty close if not right on by now... Gas pedal maybe a little softer...

    I would suggest looking under the hood at night.. Bad Plug wire's or cap is really bad on performance. It will cause the popping or noise went letting off on the pedal...

    Weird stuff with the vacuum.Tran won't shift right.....................

    I had a vehicle
    that looked like a christmas tree at night..Maybe you can't see the arc
    from the wire's but try spraying them with WD40.and see how it runs..
    If better you know to have plug wires changed and look for any other
    wire's that might have cracks allowing electrical arc's...

    If that has happened check the inside of the cap for arcing and brown buildup and scrap lit-ely to remove the buildup and away you go.....

    The rest of the solutions are not worth it..Hope that helps!


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To see the recent links (if you have membership), try just signing in from the homepage and going under your recent comments. It should show the newly listed links there and it should help you with your main problem with the car.

Posted on Nov 07, 2008

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Hello dkgeneralmai
I would think after reading all the solutions that you would have fixed the throttle problem.. Disconnect and move it to see if it was the cable or the carb linkage that was stiff and spray with WD40 to free it up..
I'am trying to help with the poor performance..If no knocks on start up, oil is good and just runs crappy....Hmmm.
Timing is lets say pretty close if not right on by now... Gas pedal maybe a little softer...
I would suggest looking under the hood at night.. Bad Plug wire's or cap is really bad on performance. It will cause the popping or noise went letting off on the pedal...
Weird stuff with the vacuum.Tran won't shift right.....................
I had a vehicle that looked like a christmas tree at night..Maybe you can't see the arc from the wire's but try spraying them with WD40.and see how it runs.. If better you know to have plug wires changed and look for any other wire's that might have cracks allowing electrical arc's...
If that has happened check the inside of the cap for arcing and brown buildup and scrap lit-ely to remove the buildup and away you go.....
Good luck and thank you...

Posted on Nov 07, 2008

  • Paul Nov 08, 2008

    Hi dkgeneralmai

    You dismiss electrical... I don't... Motor has been replaced.. If a good motor was installed and good installers did the job..I still say to check all connectors.... There is a soft short somewhere.. You've dismiss'ed solutions here as not working, maybe the best bet would be to take it for hands'on diag... You seem to have a good grip on machanic's of the vehicle..A hands on look at the vehicle would prove to be the best...as this seems to be one tough cookie to crack...

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  • Toyota Master
  • 19,396 Answers

If you cannot see all the comment, try accessing the original thread here.

Posted on Nov 06, 2008

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Just something else you will want to do:
check and clean MAFM ( mass air flow meter) and TPS ( throttle position sensor) as these sensors are important to the computer and timming , also they can effect the transmision shifting or hesitation let alone the running conditions
here is a cool place that will show how to do a test on the tps sensor http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTricks/TPS/index.shtml#Troubleshooting
a MAFM (mass air flow meter) can fool the computer in believing there is more air than there is or less air than there is causing the engine not to work properly sometimes cleaning it helps but others then have to be replaced

Posted on Nov 06, 2008

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As far as your throttle, You need to unhook the throttle cable and manually move the throttle plate if it eases up then your cable is binding. fix this with a new cable. if it is still hard to open then you have som bent linkage or the bore has been messed up somejow and will need to be replaced.The popping back thru exhaust sounds like you may also have a timing issue could be just slightly off

Posted on Nov 06, 2008

  • TripleTauto
    TripleTauto Nov 06, 2008

    I understand you wanting to wait for toyota ed he is very knowledgeable in toyota's but you have rated him already and you may need to personally ask him if you have not done so.



    I am ase certified master tech and as far as your throttle problem you need to look at what I have said need to fix that first and then we can see what is going on

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You need to check your ign timming and adjust

make sure you follow the recomended procedure
this should cure your lack of power issue
later paul

Posted on Nov 06, 2008

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This is TOYOTA ED speaking now, all other posters please step off.
OK, Dgeneralmai, let me analyze your situation. In short, you have no power, a throttle issue, popping noises, a warm up issue, and a lack of speed on mountain ascents. Wow. THIS is a real challenge, and what you are about to read is a professional reply from a professional Toyota mechanic, as opposed to the other posters, who, for lack of better reasons, seem to make themselves feel good about themselves by posting BS info to you to grab a few of your bucks.
Note that this is NOT what FixYa is all about, sir, there are professionals who help, and non-professionals who steal. On behalf of FixYa, I apologize to you for the myriad of innuendo that you had to undergo until I got here to help you.
So, Here we go...Before I can get you a viable solution, I need some clarifications from you
First, the warm-up issue. Where is the temp gauge when you drive, does it ride at 1/2 way up after 10 minutes?
Sticking throttle: Easy fix
Popping noises: Please explain how you set the timing, if you have done so... there is a special procedure necessary to accomplish this.
Power on hills: Does the tach increase as the mph slows?
Idiot light: Does the check engine light illuminate with the key at the "on" position?
Get this stuff back to me, and I will assist you. Please ignore most of the others, they have no clue as to what they are talking about.

Posted on Nov 06, 2008

  • 1 more comment 
  • Toyota Ed Nov 06, 2008

    ...without input from you sir, I cannot properly assist you.

  • Toyota Ed Nov 06, 2008

    Ok. What you have are several issues. Let me tackle them one by one.

    TIMING: The base timing should be 10 degress BTDC. To properly set the timing, you or your tech needs to JUMP terminals "E1" and "Te1", in the small box under the hood. Then connect the timing light, and set it to 10 degrees. If this setting can NOT be acheived with motion of the distributor, as I suspect, you have a timing belt that is off one tooth. This will explain the popping and gurgling sounds. In regards to the throttle being stiff, I would suggest to you to remove the tube going from the air cleaner box to the throttle plate/throttle body area. This is the circular flapper where the gas pedal cable connects to the engine. Remove the tube, and inspect the interior of the throttle plate area, It should be VERY clean, and shiny. If it is very dirty, black & crusty, clean it with good carb cleaner. Here is a real good test: the cable to the throttle bodyu is easily removed. Take the cable off, and manually open the throttle valve...Does it still stick? If so, this is where you need to start. Keep cleaning it until it is spotless. Remove the screw on top of the throttle plate and spray cleaner down into the hole. Replace the screw, start it up, and reset the screw to reset your base idle. Post back if you desire additional information. Most of this should really benefit you. Glad to be able to provide you with my professional assistance.

  • Toyota Ed Nov 07, 2008

    Have a great day, and thanks for choosing FixYA!

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Hi,

A possible reason for the need to downshift on a rise is a light flywheel, did you change the transmission as well? As to your other concerns:

  • warmup, 10 minutes - have you checked the thermostat. maybe stuck in open position?
  • small incline, slip clutch. high RPM - all indicates an underpowered engine or engine to drivetrain mismatch;
  • gurgling and popping sound - air/fuel mixture, I am inclined to think on the lean side; or
  • timing a bit of retarded, might need to be 17*btdc base; or
  • have you tried larger injectors (330cc @ 41/43psi)
Hope this be of initial help/idea. Pls post back how things turned up or should you need additional information. Good luck and kind regards. Thank you for using FixYa.

Posted on Nov 06, 2008

  • Louie  Role
    Louie Role Nov 06, 2008

    Incidentally, the 17*btdc would hold especially true for JDM 3VZ engines.

  • Louie  Role
    Louie Role Nov 07, 2008

    and Hi again,

    ToyotaEd has presented to you the timing procedures and he suggested 10 degrees. Perhaps you could verify/set the timing as he prescribed.

    If on the other hand, the replacement engine is a JDM (Japanese Domestic Model), might I suggest the 17 degrees. Most JDM's are restricted/detuned hence my suggestion of advancing.

    Incidentally, have you tried swapping the sensors from the old engine to the replacement engine. It is possible that the temp threshold of the new engine is different with the old and the engine's computer is getting erroneous signals and therefore sending wrong triggers.


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A. This is going to be very difficult to offer an opinion on since I can't hear the noise itself and there could be a number of causes. As an educated guess, it would seem the problem is with the input shaft bearing or other internal transmission bearing.
It is also possible that there is a problem with the clutch or, if the noise is apparent only when actually moving, the CV joints or drive axles.
That puff of steam is normal, nothing to worry about. It's just condensation inside the pipes.

Posted on Nov 06, 2008

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Hi!!!

try to check the heater
of your engine
or may be the injection pump
try to check

Posted on Nov 06, 2008

  • ronald suboc
    ronald suboc Nov 07, 2008

    hi!!!

    try bring in the service center!
    may be it helps


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You need toyta_ed, dont accept a solution till you come across his. :)

Posted on Nov 06, 2008

  • Graeme Ross
    Graeme Ross Nov 06, 2008

    Hi again, I would have somebody floor on the accelerator pedal, and go check that you are getting full throttle at the butterfly. May be the stiff throttle, is actually not allowing you to get the peddle to the metal.



    regards

    robotek

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The first thing you should do is give the throttle chamber a good cleaning.  That is very handy & could very well solve the problem.

Second try, using an injector cleaner
Third try,  A light tapping is probably harmless. Quiet valves, if they are mechanical, could mean trouble.

Fourth one, I heard of an instance where the remote starter didn't start the car. After lots of work by the dealer, many replacements etc, it was found that it was the battery. They replaced the battery and all was well.

Posted on Nov 06, 2008

  • Puneet Jain
    Puneet Jain Nov 07, 2008

    Change the Crank shaft of the Engine will resolve your problem almost and upto my knowledge.

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All is normal. high altitudes has low air pressure so air compression inside your car's engine is also low resulting to low engine power.
check your engine oil before starting again your car before leaving home. see if its too thick.
thick oil contributes to less friction reduction inside your engine resulting to hard starting.
try to change engine oil, use thin synthetic oil (ones used during cold sesson)

Posted on Nov 06, 2008

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  • Rommel Balcita Nov 06, 2008

    no need to overhaul your engine.



  • Rommel Balcita Nov 06, 2008

    check this out to see the difference on motor oil performance:
    Motor oil must be able to flow at cold winter temperatures to lubricate internal moving parts upon starting up the engine. Another important property of motor oil is its pour point, which is indicative of the lowest temperature at which the oil could still be poured satisfactorily. The lower the pour point temperature of the oil, the more desirable the oil is when starting up at cold temperature.

    I've copied this one at wikipedia


  • Rommel Balcita Nov 06, 2008

    check this site also for more info on motor oil and engine performance
    http://www.ehow.com/how_4512372_choose-b...


  • Rommel Balcita Nov 06, 2008

    well the, if motor oils is no problem to your car, you should check/clean fuel filters, injectors.
    head gasket could also have the possibilty that is partly damaged reducing compression.


  • Rommel Balcita Nov 06, 2008

    worn-out piston rings and cylinder sleeve could also be possible.

  • Rommel Balcita Nov 06, 2008

    if your pedal connects to your engine with a cable, try to put on it. inside the cable.
    also put oil on the pedal axles.


  • Rommel Balcita Nov 06, 2008

    when driving uphill, especially when foggy. air compression would be lower. it would only be normal for the car to climb on the 3rd gear,
    lucky to run yours on the forth! nice car you have



  • Rommel Balcita Nov 06, 2008

    try to pit oil on the cable. (sorry i missed)

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You need to do the complete overhalling/service to overcome all defects.

Posted on Nov 06, 2008

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Toyota Ed really knows his stuff, you would be wise to at least take a look at his suggestions before rejecting them out of hand, he is a very bright guy on the subject of Toyota cars and trucks.

Posted on Nov 06, 2008

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  • yadayada
    yadayada Nov 07, 2008

    I would try live chat on this issue, and request a refund on this session, then you can ask questions in real time, if you are lucky the expert5 will let you call him or her.

  • yadayada
    yadayada Nov 07, 2008

    Why not tell us what answer you are looking for??

  • yadayada
    yadayada Nov 07, 2008

    Give it a rest and get a quality shop involved.

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